Considering LEDs? Here's my take on it (Halides VS LEDs)

[JohnnyAirtime]

I swapped out Halides for LEDs, and am impressed.
(most information taken from my "240 Build" thread)

Why the swap? well, hopefully this thread can explain some of that and you get an idea of Halides VS LEDs in my findings.

I'll give you the icing, before the cake;
I love my LEDs, and am glad I removed the Halides. No matter what you see as far as a light output measurement in my posts, the corals love the LEDs (they open up, and color up!), and even the fish are much more colorful.

Now, onto my findings;

COLORING up of the corals and fish. I love the color. But, YOU need to be the judge of that, and understand my LACK of ability to take proper photos. For that, here's some of what I already posted;

It's really hard to base a decision on pictures. In person it's MUCH different. And like I said, the camera could be only picking up specific colors and washing out others. I'm definitely not a photographer, and just put the camera on "auto" and went with it. But... hang on, I'll show you a shot that has LEDs on the left... and Halide on the right. Not a photoshopped and combined picture, but a picture I took when installing the LEDs to show the difference. This way, you can see the difference in one picture, rather than two different pictures with two different color/white balances.

Here ya go... you can see a better or more accurate color difference; ... all I did was crop and add the red line. It's one picture.



And here's a video link *click on picture*... (don't mind my fan going in the background!)... to the same LED on left, and Halide/T5 on right;

[JohnnyAirtime]

And yet another... please, remember... the white balance of the camera is doing so AUTOMATICALLY. If I had learned, or took the time to adjust the white balance, I'm sure you'd see the true coloring of both Halide and LED. However, the LEDs are actually much whiter than the picture shows;

See if this gif comparison works for you all
(this was taken with my DSLR camera on a tripod, in 'auto' setting... so, it did it's own color/white balancing);



... what do you think??

It's actually more white in person, the camera makes it look more purple.

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[JohnnyAirtime]

Here's my output readings;

Here are my final LUX/PAR results...
(NOTE: the results aren't scientific, and my method of measuring was attempted to be the same from Halide to LED. Meaning, I used the same methods to place the sensor in the tank each time. Take it with a grain of salt if you will... and judge which form of lighting is best for you in each situation)

[bpro32]

The corals colors definitely do pop more with the bluer led's.

[JohnnyAirtime]

As you can tell, there's not much more output from the LEDs and in most instances the Halides are doing better.

I chalk this up to the LEDs being VERY direct. With no reflector like a Halide, they are very "focused". For example, (if your a DIYer) when you do your own DIY kit, take into account your degree in optics. My LEDs are 120° and still are very limited in the spread in comparison to the halides and reflectors being used. I love the fact I simply ordered them, paid, and had them in 10days. No need to DIY here, when these were cheaper than a DIY kit.

If I were to do an SPS tank, I'd add one more LED fixture to my 4... making it 5 fixtures and move the SPS up in the rock work. If and when you move the LED fixture closer to the water (to get higher PAR), you just narrowed it's spread across the tank... thus, needing one more panel to cover the dark areas or places of less PAR. Make sense?

I'm a softie tank, with some LPS... and all are doing very well under the new lighting so far.

The numbers you see, are only as a guideline and from my knowledge and calculations not a "real" par number per-se. But as close as I could get by using a LUX meter (if you want to know more about LUX meters, and PAR meters... google it, and know that they both measure light and color of light differently). I simply did some math to get the readings closer to what most reef enthusiasts would understand. For example, if you see "210" on my chart... know, it's not a 'real' par reading of 210... but a LUX reading of 10,500. Confused yet? I sure was... but learned a lot from reading and understanding the two different measurements. The point of the "numbers" on the chart, are to give you an idea of the output of the Halide and LED lighting. If you want a real comparison, which includes the color of the light and it's output... a PAR meter needs to be used.

Some of the things I noticed;
- pictures don't do any justice for comparisons. Even with my D90 DSLR. In person is the only way to compare.
- Using the same tank scenario, shimmer with LEDs is less, then with Halides. But you still have some shimmer
- halides give an appearance of natural sun and shadows on the corals. LEDs do not.
(due to them having multiple lights spread across a large area for output, rather than one light source)
- the heat difference is amazing. LEDs have fairly any heat, in comparison to the halides (egg cookers).
- LEDs, have no worries when turning them on/off. No wait times. Halides don't like constant on/off testing.
- I love the fact I don't have ballasts with LEDs. No bulky things to hide, or deal with.
- The LED fixture's 3 fans are noisy when comparing to a silent halide bulb.
- The LED fixture is very directional. Where a Halide gives more light (depending on reflector used) at a wider angle.

MY MAIN REASON for swapping out to the LEDs was due to HEAT. It was a hot week when I installed my 240gal, and put those (4) 250W halides in above the water. My house was hotter, and the 'sump room' was unbearably hot as it contained my chiller and my halide ballasts. The tank was in a living room, and considerably hotter than any other room in the house (besides the sump room). This heat issue, caused the 1/3hp chiller to run almost all day. UGH! I thought about bringing the SDG&E power meter into the house and using it as a fan! My soon to be wife, pays the utilities... and wasn't too happy at that thought! So heat, and elect. bill were my main reasons... NOT coral color or light intensity.

I hope this helps your decision on whether to go LED over Halides.

ANY questions or comments... PLEASE don't hesitate to ask!!

[Waves in Glass]

Outstanding writeup... only thing is I beleive if you used an actual PAR meter you would hevr higher reading in the LED range and lower in MH. LUX reads whole spectrum i beleive and PAR reades usable spectrum.

On the fans.. invest in some silenx brand fans from frys and they will be completely silent.

[JohnnyAirtime]

Outstanding writeup... only thing is I beleive if you used an actual PAR meter you would hevr higher reading in the LED range and lower in MH. LUX reads whole spectrum i beleive and PAR reades usable spectrum.

On the fans.. invest in some silenx brand fans from frys and they will be completely silent.

Thanks Larry. You were a big help, and one's opinion/experience that pushed me along in my research.

I won't pretend to know all about LUX and PAR, but I do know LUX is more about luminesce measuring and takes into account the green spectrum and what the human eye "sees". Lots of info here; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lux ....And PAR is a measurement of the usable light (PPFD) in the regions 400-700nm but not necessarily according to lumens. Lots more info here; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photosy...radiation_(PAR).

... being I compared the Halides (in a 14,000K) and to LEDs (with 12,000K, 450nm and 420nm), yes... the LEDs would have shown a higher PAR rating if a PAR meter is used, but not by much "in my opinion". The 420/450nm doesn't give off as much light as a 12,000K and wouldn't directly be a 1:1 increase in PAR ratio (again, in my opinion). Also, don't forget I had (4) T5 bulbs in this measurement that give off a similar range of light as the LED panels. Again, not a 1:1 (watt to watt) in comparison between T5 and LED, but it needs to be noted it wasn't JUST the Halides giving me a LUX reading. None-the-less, great point Larry!!

I've heard of the silenx fans but I'm not sure it's loud enough to invest another $120 (at $10/fan and 3 fans per fixture) into the lighting. Still a great option for those looking for a quieter fixture or those without canopies.

[BajaReefs]

Thanks for doing the work for us...very much appreciated

[xL30NxCREATORX]

i was looking at this site its almost the same as the ones you ordered selling them in lots of 4 at 185$ each fixture what do you think about it?

http://www.aliexpress.com/product-fm...olesalers.html

[JohnnyAirtime]

i was looking at this site its almost the same as the ones you ordered selling them in lots of 4 at 185$ each fixture what do you think about it?

http://www.aliexpress.com/product-fm...olesalers.html

I've never dealt with that site or company.
... alibaba sites are manufacturers posting to gain business through marketing. Great opportunity for them. But, I only have worked with the one manufacturer who would do my custom order (4 cords, 4 switches) and who is not listed in Alibaba. Nor do they have a website and they don't sell on eBay. I was referred to them via my own business lead in China (an HID manufacturer) due to their quality of craftmanship. I'm sure there's cheaper, just as there are more expensive. Kind of like buying a car... from Mercedez, to Hyundai. In some instances, I'm sure you get what you pay for. Go for it!! Let us know how you fair!!

I've sent you a PM, being I just went over all of this and LOTS of questions in PMs with you. I find it "fishy" that you'd then ask me a question about some company and pricing in my Halide VS Led thread... where, we aren't discussing "places to buy" and instead of just PM'ing the question itself... let's stay on topic, and not take this thread in a different direction... shall we?! And as I mentioned, start a thread and ask where you should be buying your LEDs and/or from whom. I'm sure you'll get lots of interest. As well, you can go over CUSTOM orders with certain specifications and all that you need in THAT thread. Thanks!

.

[JohnnyAirtime]

Due to many Reefers inquiring about the LEDs I'm using, I've posted a few informative posts about them. It'll require you to read up a bit, but it's well worth the read if your in the market for LED lighting. For example;

My Build Thread;
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...ad.php?t=79260

From Halides to LEDs;
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...ad.php?t=80226

Replacing the fans in the LED units;
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...ad.php?t=80856

This thread your reading (Considering LEDs Heres my take on it (Halides-VS-LEDs);
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...ad.php?t=80225

... in the end, I'm happy to order for fellow reefers. Just let me know if your interested (via PM preferably) and if you'd like to come over to mi casa and see them in action. In fact, I'd prefer you to see them BEFORE ordering or asking too many detailed questions... as most questions can be answered in one visit (like how to mount them). I will soon have spare fixtures to demo, and I already have spare parts in case a simple fix is needed. On my next order I'll be ordering for my own FOWLR and several demo units (with MY specifications). If you need some, get in on the order!

... I can order you anything you need.

Awesome 120W panel light, built-in timer/LCD control panel - with UV/Purple Moon LEDs! $200 all day long!
120W "timer" option (55x3 with dimmer, built-in timer, lens optics, moon lights, 4 LED color).
Click this link ---> http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...720#post785720

A nice 120W panel light, with 4 colors, dimmable and lens/optics. NO Timer.... $200 all day long!
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...214#post752214

AND... my latest and greatest option... for a 60W or 120W single pendant light.
Dimmable with IR remote control, included inline electronic timer... and 3 color Multi-chip!!
The most shimmer I've ever seen ----> http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...er.-Interested

I can also order "Strip lighting", in 24", 36" and 48" lengths. Same product(s) as "Champion lighting".
See more info here via links in post; http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...299#post732299

Simulate sunrise to sunset, with a wireless controller...
Here's a 120W/165W option. (I don't deal with this company much anymore, but will pass along the info if you'd like to order)
Click this link ---> http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...223#post709223

Group buy - my idea of what a group buy should be (I'm seeing the group buys, being abused by one LED seller)
http://www.sandiegoreefs.net/forums/...500#post768500

Contact me for any LED lighting you may need.





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[ibsriv]

Excellent post! Thanks for the effort.

[ironcross]

Larrys fixtures can be configured with up to 4 colors/4 switches/4 cords.

[Waves in Glass]

How much are your LEDS going for?

BTW the LED which I sell is not limited to four colors and can have as many colors as the purchaser desires. Most that have been sold use four different color spectrums. I Do have recommended spectrums and anything outside of that will be the purchasers risk..(some have turned out quite nicely). Additionally as a correction my LEDS can have up to four independently controlled circuits (four plugs and four switches)

[JohnnyAirtime]

How much are your LEDS going for?

$240.00 Out The Door (shipped to me, no taxes, no payment fees)
(but I had already stated I wasn't going to post prices publicly due to your SDreef sales and being respectful. Well since you asked.... there ya go )

BTW the LED which I sell is not limited to four colors and can have as many colors as the purchaser desires. Most that have been sold use four different color spectrums. I Do have recommended spectrums and anything outside of that will be the purchasers risk..(some have turned out quite nicely). Additionally as a correction my LEDS can have up to four independently controlled circuits (four plugs and four switches)

I understand, and wasn't disputing such information. I was simply linking to your posts so that a buyer can do as they so please. I changed my link, to not say "3 color"... and to say "starting at". If neither of those suit your sales... let me know.

I too can order any color, any specification, or to whatever the reefer desires. However, that's not my intent... nor, does it help the individual looking to buy. In fact, I think it will confuse the majority as there's just too many options. The few who know what they want specifically, can request it and order as they see fit. However, my personal goal was to learn from what's out there and order per my own specification, in turn helping reefers with a "simple solution" that is truly a good combination of color, output as well as controlling functions.

Ultimately, I'm not here to say what heat sink is better, who has the better light, or to disqualify anyone's LED sales or to find flaws in them (not saying you, or anyone else is either)... I'm simply offering a simple solution at a decent cost to the end user, and so pumped up about it... that I like to share that fun and excitement with others. I think if anything, people can learn from my posts and it'll help them in their choices going forward.