New administration and our hobby. Read Please help

[SolRo]

I like how the bill is something entirely created by congress, with no direction from obama, yet every paraniod rightwinger came here to take a dump on the president who is in a seperate branch of government.

8 more years, get used to it.

[SolRo]

Or to paraphrase almost every single person on the right in the last 8 years;

"If you don't like it, move to Canada"

[stephj03]

That might work except Canada already has big gov full of unnaffordable entitlements. That would mean conservatives moving to a more liberal society that is farther down the path towards Western European style socialism than we are right now. The converse suggestion allthough tongue in cheek did make sense, people not satisfied with a right of center gov moving to a society with a left of center gov.

[Techknowledgy]

I am not moving to Canada, but I will share my sweet corals and fish with the less fortunate as long as they are willing to care for them and pay for them with dead presidents. It took a long time to get us into this mess. Let the guy (no- he is not the Messiah....) do his job. It will get better, as long as every one of US does our job. If your Chevy breaks down, fix it.
....... and OBTW... the largest government run program, other than our defense department, is Homeland Security. Created under the Bush regime.

[stephj03]

No one wants to talk about congress bc most on both sides are unhappy with them. The approval rating of congress is lower than Bush's ever were and has been for some time. You can't have an arguement about who's right predicated on an issue that both parties essentially agree on. Which is afterall what most of these threads end up being.

[zoa]

I hope they go all the way!
Its JUST a hobby, its not JUST the planet...
Speaking as someone whose going to have to live with what other people have done/are doing to the planet for the next 60 years, i wish they would ban the burning of hydrocarbons.
My name is Trever and I am a radical Im going to look at things with an educated approach and not "Drill baby drill!" And i think thats okie dokie

umm how much power does your tank draw? primarily coal is powering the grid... is coal a hydrocarbon?

edit: PS I support renewable energy and feel guilty about my power usage ...

[stephj03]

I think one of the frustrations conservatives have with this type of discousre is the assumption by his critics that Bush was a conservative. On social issues probably. On foreign policy, definitely hawkish. But on fiscal policy not the least bit conservative. Just bc Bush spent and grew is no reason for Obama to compete with him. If you are a conservative this habit was bad enough for the last 8yrs and is in the proccess of getting worse. On fiscal issues Bush and Obama actually have a lot in common. Big deficit spending not bc we have the money to spend, but bc we "qualify" for the loan from the Chinese and "we really need this stuff". Seems to me that neither learned anything from the mistakes of so many private citizens in the real estate and financial sectors.

[ocean1]

You want a REAL stimulus? Do you they could have given every LEGAL tax paying American $ 47,000.00 ?? Thats just so far with the trillions in bailouts and stimulus money. It was on Fox news. Now if I got a check for 47k I would go buy some serious stuff maybe even a new GM car. Millions would do the same. Bottom line why would they do that when they can ""loan"" the money with they strict guidance and over sight from the Government. Some states are even afraid to take the carrot.
Its not all Obama (not yet lol) its has a lot to do with Congress. Just some tough times everyone is going through.
Yes Homeland security was created under Bush but you remember why right? Planes, towers, sounds like Obama, the Cole, Etc etc.............

[Techknowledgy]

Some assumptions you make are a bit out there.

1. Fox News is not journalism. It is propaganda. (Does anyone REALLY take Sean Hannity seriously?)
2. I am a Democrat, and I do not love either taxes or big government.
3. The lions share of our taxes do not go to the poor. They go to the "military industrial complex."

..... and I feel guilty about using energy too- but I am a reef addict and can't help myself. Maybe we need a 12 Step Program for us? First I have to admit that I have a problem.........

Where do I sign up to have SDG&E put a photo voltaic array in my backyard?

[warjose]

I vote for stephj03!

[warjose]

Honestly I'm impressed with the arguments on both sides, it's been fun hearing everyone's contributions. Thank you all.

[SolRo]

I think one of the frustrations conservatives have with this type of discousre is the assumption by his critics that Bush was a conservative. On social issues probably. On foreign policy, definitely hawkish. But on fiscal policy not the least bit conservative. Just bc Bush spent and grew is no reason for Obama to compete with him. If you are a conservative this habit was bad enough for the last 8yrs and is in the proccess of getting worse. On fiscal issues Bush and Obama actually have a lot in common. Big deficit spending not bc we have the money to spend, but bc we "qualify" for the loan from the Chinese and "we really need this stuff". Seems to me that neither learned anything from the mistakes of so many private citizens in the real estate and financial sectors.

Obama needs to spend though, any economist would tell you that a depression is the worst time for government to cut spending.

[SolRo]

You want a REAL stimulus? Do you they could have given every LEGAL tax paying American $ 47,000.00 ?? Thats just so far with the trillions in bailouts and stimulus money. It was on Fox news. Now if I got a check for 47k I would go buy some serious stuff maybe even a new GM car. Millions would do the same. Bottom line why would they do that when they can ""loan"" the money with they strict guidance and over sight from the Government. Some states are even afraid to take the carrot.
Its not all Obama (not yet lol) its has a lot to do with Congress. Just some tough times everyone is going through.
Yes Homeland security was created under Bush but you remember why right? Planes, towers, sounds like Obama, the Cole, Etc etc.............

Fox wasn't complaining one bit when banks got 1 trillion, now that things and programs OTHER than banks are getting money...WELL THAT WONT DO!

[iwantone]

We don't have to move to canada or france. The USA will be the biggest socialist country in the world. Everyone will have free healthcare and have their mortgages paid. G-d bless OBAMA, ACORN, Farakan, Rev Wright, Nancy Pelosi, Kevin Lay... They will take of all of us unless we have a job that they deem pays too much.

[Blaze]

We don't have to move to canada or france. The USA will be the biggest socialist country in the world. Everyone will have free healthcare and have their mortgages paid. G-d bless OBAMA, ACORN, Farakan, Rev Wright, Nancy Pelosi, Kevin Lay... They will take of all of us unless we have a job that they deem pays too much.

Are you taking a Piss, bro?