we might get drafted

[BlueLagoonSD]

http://www.congress.org/congressorg/issues/alert/?alertid=5834001&content_dir=ua_congressorg

read it yourself guys...pack your bags..you might be drafted to fight for our country.

[Alexsd]

No wayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

[brahm]

Originally posted by BlueLagoonSD
http://www.congress.org/congressorg/issues/alert/?alertid=5834001&content_dir=ua_congressorg

read it yourself guys...pack your bags..you might be drafted to fight for our country.

OH but a wait, when you say WE you don't me ME as I was born in Canada! HA

[Flamehawk]

hmmm....this world just full of surprises

[ricestudios]

i will find a loop hole to get out of it!

[ninhsavestheday]

HA! when it says congress.GOV ... ill start worrying.

[brahm]

Originally posted by ninhsavestheday
HA! when it says congress.GOV ... ill start worrying.

true dat. oh wait i'll also be 27 by the time it's in effect, but I donnu if they wanted me to go over and do IT stuff. I'd go aslong as i get to shoot an m16 at some crappy dell's and emachines.

[nalbar]

speaking as a person who lived through the draft (i came THIS close!) i can tell you this;

there is NO way, short of a world war, that america will EVER have a draft again. any president who proposes it and any congress who votes for it will not be in office long. iraq actually PREVENTS a draft, not encourages one. this is because no mother will allow one after watching her government botch that adventure. mothers want to believe their sons lives will be treated with consideration and value.

another thing that NEVER gets mentioned, these days 18 year olds VOTE. that did not used to be true. no 18 to 21 year old is going to vote for a party that puts them in the army. it was easy to enslave 18 year olds when they did not vote. people forget that before 1971 you could not vote until you were 21! it is no coincidence that lowered voting age/vietnam/ending the draft all happen around the same time. but can you imagine the youth vote turnout if a draft was threatened?

one other reason...a draft makes presidential and congressional sons eligible. no way they allow that. not ONE single son or daughter of bushes administration is in the military. NOT ONE. out of congess there are only TWO members of congress whos sons or daughters are in the military. these people have taught their children the values they REALLY have, and it does not include military service, which they believe is for suckers. if they did not teach their children military service has a value do you REALLY think they will FORCE them to serve?


nalbar

[SDMike]

Originally posted by Chap
Good! All you slackers need to serve your country for a few years ;) Hmm maybe I should go back down to MCRD and do another tour as a Drill Instructor... inflicting mental and physical pain is so much fun :D

You must be schizo. Evil DI Chapman and nice Mr. Chappie...

M

[suver569]

Good think I'm a complete gimp, and the military wouldnt want me anyways :p

[ronreef]

Ask yourself this question....
When it really come down to it and YOUR country really needs your service... would you serve and fight for the US of A?

[suver569]

I guess it boils down to lots of questions, but if my country needed me to fight for the USA, I wouldnt think twice about it. Any red-blooded american should have no problem fighting for his/her country. What I dont believe in is fighting other countries wars.

I no expert by any means, but I dont fully agree with the decisions that are made sometimes, but hey, that's democracy for you. I'm proud to be an american, and I'll stand by my country and it's decisions, regardless if I agree or not.

It's kinda like a marriage to me. I may not agree with my wife, but I stand by her no matter what. Doesnt mean I'll fight a fight for her, but I will support her.

I feel satisfied in what I do, which is building America (Building San Diego to be more specific.) Everyone has there part

[ronreef]

Yup, I agree. When it comes down to it... when it comes down to fighting for our country... you can count me in. Bottom line.

Ron

[brahm]

Although i'm not american born. I can understand feeling the need to fight for your country, but I think there is a big diffrence between fighting for your country (ie.. defending the states), and giving up your life for One polticians personal war.

[ronreef]

It's more a question of should we take it to them or have them take it to us? I would rather that we fight them out there than fight them here on home turf. It's tough enough already when your own countrymen don't give a damn about the country they live in.

[brahm]

...you seriously think iraq was going to magically amass a navy that they didn't have and come all the way over to the states and attack us on our soil? Don't get me wrong, I don't think going to war in Iraq was 100% a bad thing, I just think that the longer this drags out the worse it's going to get.

[Mike N]

Amazing thing about being an American, you have the right to say whatever you'd like, think what ever you like, and live any life you can make for yourself!

If you think Iraq was only one mans war then perhaps you should spend some time in Iraq and see the people there first hand. I have...

Remember if you dislike the United States you can always leave, strage thing about that most people don't.

"The object of war is not to die for one's country, but to make the other poor ******* die for his."

George Patton

PS ~ Brahm my Mother was born in Canada and served in the US Army during the war.

[ronreef]

yeah, abracadabra and ... poof... a navy... c'mon now.

What I meant about "them" is terrorism in general.
We're making a stand and putting out a point.

[brahm]

Originally posted by Mike N
Amazing thing about being an American, you have the right to say whatever you'd like, think what ever you like, and live any life you can make for yourself!

If you think Iraq was only one mans war then perhaps you should spend some time in Iraq and see the people there first hand. I have...

Remember if you dislike the United States you can always leave, strage thing about that most people don't.

"The object of war is not to die for one's country, but to make the other poor ******* die for his."

George Patton

PS ~ Brahm my Mother was born in Canada and served in the US Army during the war.

Yea I'm sure the people of IRAQ are a tradegy, but if you want to see a tradegy go to Downtown LA any nite of the week, we have enough problems in the states we should spend some reasources bettering ourselves, on our hungry, and dying, and our sick. Imagine if half that gaint war budget went or even a 1/4 heck if we just stopped dropping bombs are used the money we spent on bombs for a healthcare system, or to improve YOUR kids school system think of what we could accomplish Here!

Why is it when ever somebody disagree's with what a current elected member of the goverment is doing. The response is leave! I don't have a problem with the states. I disagree with the decissions of some current elected officail and because of that you suggest I Leave.. How American is that. Disagree LEAVE! It must be one of the not so well known constitutional amendments because I find when ever somebody takes a stand point that doesn't agree with what a current elected officail is doing That lame ass response always creeps up.

The fact of the matter is, as long as we are at war, the issues and problems at home get swept under the rug for the next president to deal with nobody has time to pay attention to domestic issues when there is LATE BREAKING NEWS FROM THE WAR FRONT ON IRAQ. I guess it's much easier to play soilder then run a country.

[brahm]

Originally posted by ronreef
yeah, abracadabra and ... poof... a navy... c'mon now.

What I meant about "them" is terrorism in general.
We're making a stand and putting out a point.

Iraq and Al Queda show me the link. Iraq hasn't done any Terrorist attacks on the united states. Don't tell me he Harbours terrorist.. Ok well So do we, heck we even trained, armed and funded Osma Bin Ladin.. Why aren't those people being held accoutable for there action.

[Mike N]

"you seriously think iraq was going to magically amass a navy that they didn't have and come all the way over to the states and attack us on our soil?"

So are you saying that Iraq didn't have a Navy, or one that couldn't conduct an attack against the US mainland? Both opinions are incorrect. I think the submarines they purchased from Russia and China would have allowed them to do so, and I'm certain that you're aware that Iraq HAD the third largest standing Army of any country in the world.

Yemen, Beirut, Lebanon, and yes even Pearl Harbor weren't our soil, but still they were all attacks upon the United States. An enemy doesn't have to come to California to attack the US.

Your initial comment about NOT BEING BORN HERE led me to believe that you were not a citizen, hence you wouldn't have any say in the running of our government? Perhaps I'm wrong, but doesn’t Canada have some problems that you can discuss rather than to complain about political decisions that you have no say in?

When you speak in terms such as: we have enough problems, we even trained, we should spend, our hungry, and dying, our sick, we just stopped, on our soil - it leads me to believe that you are in fact a citizen, willing and able to assist this great nation in solving it's problems? Are you really speaking about our nation, or one you've been allowed to visit?

I never suggested that "you" leave brahm, but it is an option if you really don't like it here. I always admire people that complain about problems, but do nothing to help the situation. Rather like hecklers, not on either team, but loud and obnoxious never the less.

"I guess it's much easier to play soldier then run a country."

Not that you would know anything about doing either of these jobs :mad:

You sit in your comfortable chair writing about things you know nothing about because of the sacrifices that countless veterans have made to give you your freedom to do so.

Go to the VA Hospital tell the maimed and disfigured, that they were just "playing soldier".

Go to the National Cemetery in Point Loma and tell the widows, sons, and daughters that their loved ones died while "playing soldier".

Heck you can even go to your local VFW, and tell them about how they were just "playing soldier".

You may find that your opinions are best kept to yourself.

Until you've stood the watch, don't tell those of us who have; that we've "played solder".

I've got another idea how to add to the domestic aid coffers.
How about we quit subsidizing education benefits for non-citizens (like people from Canada), quit giving aid to countries that never repay us, and quite providing a protective umbrella to countries that reside under our protection only to complain about the way in which we provide that protection. Then we'd have enough money for any public program citizens wanted.

PS Canada would be a suburb of Russia had the U.S. not spent trillions of dollars on its military budget.

[Mike N]

Can we please get back to Reef Stuff NOW...;)

[treylane]

www.snopes.com/politics/military/draft.asp

[ronreef]

Mike,

Powerful statement!
You took the words right out of my mouth.

Regards,
Ron

[ronreef]

I'd say taking out the Iraqi dictator was a good thing.
You know... no more torture chambers... no more mass graves....
no more oppression.... they've turned a corner.
As for the aspects on fighting terrorism aborad, I would say
we are doing a fine good job... maybe not enough... but a fine job at that.
Like I said, lets take the fight to them.

[brahm]

So are you saying that Iraq didn't have a Navy, or one that couldn't conduct an attack against the US mainland? Both opinions are incorrect. I think the submarines they purchased from Russia and China would have allowed them to do so, and I'm certain that you're aware that Iraq HAD the third largest standing Army of any country in the world.



I'm sure the 1 or 2 antiquated subs they bought would have done sooo much damage. 3rd largest standing army with no way to moblize it. What were they going to do have them all swim over to the US?



Yemen, Beirut, Lebanon, and yes even Pearl Harbor weren't our soil, but still they were all attacks upon the United States. An enemy doesn't have to come to California to attack the US.


..so they attacked other countries and that's now attacking us? Or are you refering to a few terrorist attacks done by small groups not an entire COUNTRY



Your initial comment about NOT BEING BORN HERE led me to believe that you were not a citizen, hence you wouldn't have any say in the running of our government? Perhaps I'm wrong, but doesn’t Canada have some problems that you can discuss rather than to complain about political decisions that you have no say in?


I have duel citzenship.



When you speak in terms such as: we have enough problems, we even trained, we should spend, our hungry, and dying, our sick, we just stopped, on our soil - it leads me to believe that you are in fact a citizen, willing and able to assist this great nation in solving it's problems? Are you really speaking about our nation, or one you've been allowed to visit?


See the above, but what are you saying cause some random group of people a couple hundred years ago decided to draw a line in the sand and say this is mine you have more of a right to be here then i do?




I never suggested that "you" leave brahm, but it is an option if you really don't like it here. I always admire people that complain about problems, but do nothing to help the situation. Rather like hecklers, not on either team, but loud and obnoxious never the less.


If I don't voice my opnion who will, your mindset has been influenced by the thigns you've seen, heard, and experienced if we all just shut our mouths and only listend to one side we'd never be able to develope opinions of our own.



"I guess it's much easier to play soldier then run a country."

Not that you would know anything about doing either of these jobs :mad:


Your right but if you look through history one of the simplist ways to get your peoples minds off the problems at home is to go to war and let them worry about problems abroad. People dying in iraq sure does get more attention then under paid teachers and crowded classrooms.



You sit in your comfortable chair writing about things you know nothing about because of the sacrifices that countless veterans have made to give you your freedom to do so.


And you do? I have many family members that fought in WW2. I'm not knocking the soliders, i'm knocking the politcians I think i made that very clear.
I think it's great that these people are willing to make sacrfices I just hope they made them on educated well thought out decessions so they weren't in vain.



Go to the VA Hospital tell the maimed and disfigured, that they were just "playing soldier".

Go to the National Cemetery in Point Loma and tell the widows, sons, and daughters that their loved ones died while "playing soldier".

Heck you can even go to your local VFW, and tell them about how they were just "playing soldier".

You may find that your opinions are best kept to yourself.

Until you've stood the watch, don't tell those of us who have; that we've "played solder".


... Um Your clearly and purposely took what I said out of context. I was refering to the President, not the Soliders. That is a great little tear jerker there, but In no way was I refering to the actual soldiers who are making the sacrfices for a cause which hopefully is just, but unfortuently may not be.

it's funny how you haven't responded to any of my questions yet but have no problem trying to twist what i said.




I've got another idea how to add to the domestic aid coffers.
How about we quit subsidizing education benefits for non-citizens (like people from Canada), quit giving aid to countries that never repay us, and quite providing a protective umbrella to countries that reside under our protection only to complain about the way in which we provide that protection. Then we'd have enough money for any public program citizens wanted.



Sounds good to me, and why don't we add NOT Fighting other peoples wars for them to that list... "aka free the people of IRAQ.. let them free themselves if we are going to be doing all the above" Heck lets close our borders tear down the statue of liberty and kill all the mexicans. If we wanted to chase terrorist why didn't we go to Saudia Arabi where they get there money from.. Oh wait thats are good ole buddies pal, and iraq..well they don't get along with the bush family all to well..



PS Canada would be a suburb of Russia had the U.S. not spent trillions of dollars on its military budget. [/B]

PS canada burnt the white house down in 1812 whats your point.

ps.. No I'm not French Canadain, but I love that little comment. I think it's great France doesn't agree with the action and all of sudden there the but off a million jokes. I think it's great how we can't accept the other peoples opinons may differ from ours.. But just wait and see.. We are going to look back at this.. And 1 of 2 things are going to happen. We are going to regret or forget.. Somalia what?, Who? Where?

[brahm]

Oh and FYIY, regadless of my citzenship (of which i am) Although I haven't put my life on the line I have done my fair share, I spent the last 2 years of my life working for a Military contracter supporting SPAWAR, and many of the PMW's some of the things I've worked on had a direct effect in IRAQ. In making sure the troops there got the support they needed. So as I was a part of this whole big mess, and contributed to it.. I feel it's only my right to voice my opinions and concerns on the issues, and even if none of that was so I still just as have the right to voice my opinion regardless and you have to right to disagree or ignore it.

[brahm]

Originally posted by ronreef
I'd say taking out the Iraqi dictator was a good thing.
You know... no more torture chambers... no more mass graves....
no more oppression.... they've turned a corner.
As for the aspects on fighting terrorism aborad, I would say
we are doing a fine good job... maybe not enough... but a fine job at that.
Like I said, lets take the fight to them.


only time will tell if we don't end up putting a greater tyrant in his place. heck thats how he got there in the first place.

[Mike N]

Originally posted by brahm
Although I haven't put my life on the line I have done my fair share, I spent the last 2 years of my life working for a Military contracter supporting SPAWAR, and many of the PMW's some of the things I've worked on had a direct effect in IRAQ.

If you believe that Diesel submarines are no threat than you really have no grasp of Naval Doctrine.

I understand now, you're a hypocrite :rolleyes:

You work for a military contractor and obtain your pay from the same funds you say should be cut.

If the evil military budget is really preventing happiness in America, then how about you refuse your next paycheck, or donate it to the poor in LA.

Your fair share isn't working for an overpaid military contractor and calling that a sacrifice... :rolleyes:

So since you are a citizen, should we then assume that if the draft did come you'd run to Canada? That seems to be the jest of you first few posts about being born in Canada

[GEFRANKLE]

Mike:

Thanks for this corageous post. I am sure many of us feel the same but failed to speak up.

my respect,

George

[brahm]

Originally posted by Mike N
If you believe that Diesel submarines are no threat than you really have no grasp of Naval Doctrine.


Maybe i don't but we have plenty of subs and things to detect subs, do you honestly think that a couple of subs could cause the US to be taken over? And lets say they are super subs, send some guys over destory the subs, or steal them call it a day.



I understand now, you're a hypocrite :rolleyes:



..um No I'm not a hypocryte you see there is a big difference between blindly following what somebody says, and taking a step back looking at the whole situation and questioning it.. Hmm how to make this clear..

Ok.. I don't know if I agree with what is going on in IRAQ, what I do know is that there are people over in iraq that Voluntered (WERE NOT FORCED BUT CHOOSE TO SPEND A PORTION OF THERE LIFE DEFENDING WHAT THIS COUNTRY IS ABOUT) many of which are my friends (as growing up in san diego it would be hard pressed not to have friends in the military) Now these people signed up to fight and defend this country, which is comendable but what they didn't sign up for was some questionable war / police effort. Now back to why I choose to do what I was doing. Wether I like it or not, they are there, wether I like it or not, they are putting there lives in harms way, and there is nothing I can do about that. But, by me doing what I was doing maybe I helped make there lives a bit easier and I see no wrong in that.. You see, your mixing up two things.. I'm not anti-american, I don't want to see Americans die, I just don't agree with the current situation. Your coming at this from the wrong angle.. If these soilder weren't in IRAQ, they wouldn't be in HARMS way, they wouldn't HAVE to risk there lives, but aslong as they are then Yea I have no problem helping them out. My problem is with the diplomat that sent them there that would never dream of sending his own family but has no problem sending yours, and can't give us an honest answer as to why we are there in the first place..

If bush came out tommorow and said... you know what, i've go to be honest, I thought it was time we had a stronger military presense in the middle east, I'm tired of us getting raped at the pump, we're going to take over iraq flex alittle muscle and straighten things ok.. OK thats fine.. but don't bs..




You work for a military contractor and obtain your pay from the same funds you say should be cut.

and as far as cutting from the budget that I dip into, thats fine.. if I need to find another job in a diffrent line of work.. thats ok by me, if my old comany closed down was the only downside to bringing all those troops back home to there familys.. I quit!



Your fair share isn't working for an overpaid military contractor and calling that a sacrifice...
:rolleyes:


Who said it was a sacrifice I didn't use that word, I just said I helped out and was a part of it. As far as overpaid military contractors, Maybe if the military learned how to manage there budgets then they wouldn't be OVERPAID military contractors, granted you would have a load of untrained, unequipment, unprepared, broken down equipment all over the place.. But your right the world would be better off without people supporting the military... and all those ex/retired military personal it supports should go find other jobs maybe at McDonalds?



So since you are a citizen, should we then assume that if the draft did come you'd run to Canada? That seems to be the jest of you first few posts about being born in Canada [/B]


You know I haven't made up my mind about that yet, but If there wasn't a solid good reason for me to risk my life and the lives of my friends and family. Then no I wouldn't go..

The bottom line is this.. IF YOU REALLY THOUGHT THAT GOING TO WAR IN IRAQ WAS THE BEST WAY TO SUPPORT YOUR COUNTRY YOU WOULD VOLUNTER NOW AND NOT WAIT FOR A DRAFT, ANY BODY WHO SAYS OTHERWISE IS FULL OF IT. Why should people who hearts aren't into it or don't think it's the right choice have to sacrifice there lives BY FORCE and have all there freedoms ripped away from them, when there are plenty of gung ho ready americans who think the war in IRAQ is the right thing to do! Why are you sitting here chatting with me GO! Pick up your ARMS! Join one of the Merchant marines if you can't get accepted! Do your part if you think thats the right thing! But don't come knocking on my door, it wasn't my idea to go over there!

[brahm]

"I comend the man that puts his life in harms way for his country, I CONDEM the man that risks the lives of these very same men for his own glory." - Brahm G

end of discussion.

[SDMike]

Originally posted by Chap
I'm not going to get into this debate beause I think you both have very valid points (some more valid than others). But I will say this, one person in this debate has 23+ years of military service to this country under his belt... and it ain't me. Thank you for that.

"Request permission to go ashore Sir, my tour is complete!" Semper Fi Mac!

Sez the man with SEVENTEEN years in...

I'm staying the heck out of this one other than this post 'cause I agree and disagree with points y'all both have.

Just remember:
Eyes will not see when the heart wishes them to be blind.
Desire conceals truth as darkness does the earth.

Seneca

Now you two play nice or your mother and I are gonna have to send each of y'all to your rooms!

M

[elgordoinavw]

Mike N, well said couldn't have said it better.

Brahm, you say that you disagree with the tyrant serving in an elected office? did you vote? I assume since you disagree soo much you must have voted against him. Now nowhere does it say that you will be drafted and sent to war, NO WHERE. It says for civil service or military service, either way I think that it will do 18-26 year olds alot of good because once youve seen what we who have voluntereed have seen then maybe you'd be playing a different tune. I'm 24, I have served in Afgahnistan once in 2002, Iraq twice for the war in 2003 and now in 2004.
Do you know that Iraq had a stockpile of Anthrax so huge it was capable of killing Millions of humans. Yet you say they were no threat to us. You tell me what purpose does anyone have for having that much Anthrax? Do you know that in the Iraq-Iran war Iraq used Chemical weapons against Iran killing hundreds of thousands? do you know that Saddam Hussein personally ordered his henchman "Chemical Ali" to use chemical weapons against his own people Iraqi citizens, CIVILIANS men, women and children who had NO chance of surviving. The same Regime that hates America, Is it not worth risking the lives of the best trained military in the world to keep that same Regime from coming say to the port of San Diego on a "rubber ducky" launching a weapon and killing hundreds if not thousands just because they hate america. You don't understand, under the Clinton Administration all they ever did was give Saddam Hussein chance after chance after chance to comply with the many UN resolutions. When do you say enough is enough? The UN resolutions were started in 1991 and Saddam pointed his middle finger not only at us but the whole world, everytime he violated those very UN resolutions put in place not only to protect us but the world. There is soo much you just don't know and I wish I were at liberty to tell you- My role in the Marine Corps is I'm a Nuclear Biological Chemical Defense Specialist, do you think the Marine Corps spends thousands of dollars training me for the hell of it? No they do it because the threat is real, If you only knew. I'm here in Iraq right now as I write this and I know more than you or the public will ever know. I'm not just talking about Iraq but threats in the world in general.
I think that all able body people should serve the country in which they hope to prosper, civil service or military service, small price to pay for the liberties that you have to enjoy.

When have you stopped to think that every liberty you have and enjoy was bought with BLOOD, SWEAT and TEARS.

[ronreef]

All I can say is I am a partriot. I love the United States of America. I would fight and die for this country if called upon. Heck... I served in the United States Army back in the 80's.

It's as simple as this... if called upon, would you fight for the USA?

Yes?

or

No?

Don't politicize it. Just a simple "yes" or "no".

It's a shame because there are many people living in this country that would simply say "NO".

Survey says......?

[ronreef]

When have you stopped to think that every liberty you have and enjoy was bought with BLOOD, SWEAT and TEARS.

Well spoken.

[brahm]

Originally posted by elgordoinavw
Mike N, well said couldn't have said it better.

Brahm, you say that you disagree with the tyrant serving in an elected office? did you vote? I assume since you disagree soo much you must have voted against him. Now nowhere does it say that you will be drafted and sent to war, NO WHERE. It says for civil service or military service, either way I think that it will do 18-26 year olds alot of good because once youve seen what we who have voluntereed have seen then maybe you'd be playing a different tune. I'm 24, I have served in Afgahnistan once in 2002, Iraq twice for the war in 2003 and now in 2004.
Do you know that Iraq had a stockpile of Anthrax so huge it was capable of killing Millions of humans. Yet you say they were no threat to us. You tell me what purpose does anyone have for having that much Anthrax? Do you know that in the Iraq-Iran war Iraq used Chemical weapons against Iran killing hundreds of thousands? do you know that Saddam Hussein personally ordered his henchman "Chemical Ali" to use chemical weapons against his own people Iraqi citizens, CIVILIANS men, women and children who had NO chance of surviving. The same Regime that hates America, Is it not worth risking the lives of the best trained military in the world to keep that same Regime from coming say to the port of San Diego on a "rubber ducky" launching a weapon and killing hundreds if not thousands just because they hate america. You don't understand, under the Clinton Administration all they ever did was give Saddam Hussein chance after chance after chance to comply with the many UN resolutions. When do you say enough is enough? The UN resolutions were started in 1991 and Saddam pointed his middle finger not only at us but the whole world, everytime he violated those very UN resolutions put in place not only to protect us but the world. There is soo much you just don't know and I wish I were at liberty to tell you- My role in the Marine Corps is I'm a Nuclear Biological Chemical Defense Specialist, do you think the Marine Corps spends thousands of dollars training me for the hell of it? No they do it because the threat is real, If you only knew. I'm here in Iraq right now as I write this and I know more than you or the public will ever know. I'm not just talking about Iraq but threats in the world in general.
I think that all able body people should serve the country in which they hope to prosper, civil service or military service, small price to pay for the liberties that you have to enjoy.

When have you stopped to think that every liberty you have and enjoy was bought with BLOOD, SWEAT and TEARS.

That is correct I voted for gore, but even if I hadn't I still wouldn't just blindly agree with what is going on in Iraq. Yes I'm sure you find out a lot more inside information then I do, but when it comes down it yea, those are some awful things that happend, but what is IRAQ the only place where injustices of this nature are going on? Of course not. You talk about the terrible acts during Iraq Vs Iran war (you mean the war were united states finicaly backed Iraq? If that is the case that blood is on our hands aswell.)
and lets be HONEST if it wasn't for 9-11 we wouldn't be in IRAQ, right now. All that other stuff is a great PR for justification.. I wouldn't be suprised by all the thingst the marines pay money for as a Just in Case precaution witch is a good thing in my books but doesn't mean it's something that is likely going to be used or needed...

You see my main concern with the whole ordial is more for the lives of the americans over the next few years not the injustice to the iraqies.. As the body bags climb more and more people will start wonder...was it worth it? did we accomplish anything? why were we there in the first place, and the longer we are there the more enenimes we are making.

but on the draft note... what your saying is every american should be forced to join the service in some form...not a very american conecpt at all.

[brahm]

Originally posted by ronreef
Well spoken.

Exactly why i don't want to see these poor soilders throw away there lives for BS a cause.

[brahm]

Originally posted by ronreef
All I can say is I am a partriot. I love the United States of America. I would fight and die for this country if called upon. Heck... I served in the United States Army back in the 80's.

It's as simple as this... if called upon, would you fight for the USA?

Yes?

or

No?

Don't politicize it. Just a simple "yes" or "no".

It's a shame because there are many people living in this country that would simply say "NO".

Survey says......?

I answered that question already, would I go fight in IRAQ no, will I support the troops yes. If there was a creditable threat to the United states, then Yes I would join up, I would also go back to canada and fight for canada if the same situtations were taking place back there, and for Isreal aswell.

[brahm]

Brahm, you say that you disagree with the tyrant serving in an elected office?

oh, and for the record I didn't call him a tyrant you did. I like some of the stuff he has done.. Just not a fan of this one. The tyrant I was refering to on the other page was Sadam.

[Mike N]

elgordoinavw

Some people will never understand

Before God I swear this creed. My rifle and I are the defenders of my country. We are the masters of our enemy. We are the saviors of my life.

So be it, until victory is America's and there is no enemy

Some people spend an entire lifetime wondering if they made a difference in the world. But, the Marines don't have that problem.
[Ronald Reagan, U.S. President; 1985]

I'll have a cold one waiting for you on the pier, and I'll always have one for you in the reefer...

[Mike N]

Why are you sitting here chatting with me GO! Pick up your ARMS! Join one of the Merchant marines if you can't get accepted!

Listen SON, you were still suckling on the teet and ****ting in a diaper when I was standing the watch in Beruit, so don't tell me to Pick up my ARMS :p

How about you start worrying about yourself rather than to worry about those who serve in the military, we don't want you protesting the war on our behalf, we're here because we want to be, not because we have to be, but you wouldn't understand that and you never will....

I grow tired of you whining....

PS It's Israel not Isreal :p

[brahm]

Originally posted by Mike N
Listen SON, you were still suckling on the teet and ****ting in a diaper when I was standing the watch in Beruit, so don't tell me to Pick up my ARMS :p

How about you start worrying about yourself rather than to worry about those who serve in the military, we don't want you protesting the war on our behalf, we're here because we want to be, not because we have to be, but you wouldn't understand that and you never will....

I grow tired of you whining....

PS It's Israel not Isreal :p

Yawn, resulting to insults, and picking on my spelling.. Yawn..

[osidefish]

He told you he served in the Marines in Beruit and you pinpoint about his spelling corrections as his fault?


Whatever your opinion is brahm that is your right and I am here to make sure of that but please don't ever sit there and make fun of the very people that protect these shores from the simple band of terrorists that don't need a super sub just a plane ticket to Mexico and a coyote to sneak them into the United States.

From the Halls of Montezuma to the Shores of Tripoli I will fight our countries battles in the air, on land, and sea.

Semper Fi Mike N and SDMike ( squid? :) )



~~Sergeant of Marines~~

[brahm]

Originally posted by osidefish
He told you he served in the Marines in Beruit and you pinpoint about his spelling corrections as his fault?


Whatever your opinion is brahm that is your right and I am here to make sure of that but please don't ever sit there and make fun of the very people that protect these shores from the simple band of terrorists that don't need a super sub just a plane ticket to Mexico and a coyote to sneak them into the United States.

From the Halls of Montezuma to the Shores of Tripoli I will fight our countries battles in the air, on land, and sea.

Semper Fi Mike N and SDMike ( squid? :) )



~~Sergeant of Marines~~

Let me get this straight, were and when did I insult him? He insulted me, and your talking **** to me now.. I love how this works, I speak my opinion on a public forum on a topic I didn't even bring up and now your jumping down my throat. How about trying to educate me in the reason we are over there, and convince me that what we are doing is Just are right instead of Telling me what i should and shouldn't do, and should and shouldn't say, and while your convicing me of that please tell me why we need a draft in the country as well.

[treylane]

there's not gonna be a draft anytime soon, will you all settle down?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/draft.asp

[SDMike]

Originally posted by osidefish
Semper Fi Mike N and SDMike ( squid? :) )

~~Sergeant of Marines~~

Nope I was Army.

IMO, MUCH better than being Navy.

M

[SDMike]

Originally posted by treylane
there's not gonna be a draft anytime soon, will you all settle down?

http://www.snopes.com/politics/military/draft.asp

Heck! even if there WERE a draft, you're exempt!

(I agree with the "settle down" thing tho. If you can't stay civil, don't post.)

M

[sdreefer21]

First of all I highly doubt a draft. But if there is a Draft I am gonna go and i am gonna kick some a$$ for my countrymen ,its the least I can do for all that the many who have died previously and for all that might die after me. Freedom isnt free and a draft is part of living in our free country. So sack up boys were going hunting. And for all of you who wish do dodge the draft well you can always go live in china and dont forget to send me a postcard!