Seperate 4sale section for the regular guys

[davocean]

Geez louis, seems like every time I try to buy/sell something it gets buried by guys posting an entire page of BS!
One of the guys I know at least pays for sponsorship, but really, do we need a page full of used bio balls and buckets HOGGING THE ENTIRE FOR SALE SECTION!!!
And seems the same people constantly bump.
Maybe we could have a section dedicated to those using this site for a private online business, so us regular guys can buy and sell stuff w/out having to read pages of the same crap just being bumped.

[MichaelRyanSD]

:p....

[ricenoodle]

But that's the fun of the site, you're never gonna know what you're gonna find.

[Fish n' Frags]

Maybe we could have a section dedicated to those using this site for a private online business, so us regular guys can buy and sell stuff w/out having to read pages of the same crap just being bumped.

We do Dave, people who pay for sponsorship should be posting there items in there own forum. I double post at times as well, but the only place we should be posting stuff for sale is our Sponsor Forum. Like i said though, i do this as well so i am to blame also.

[davocean]

I understand, and many bump their posts here and there, I do too.
I wasn't picking on any one certain person, and even pointed out one that does pay sponsorship(though I think that person could show some consideration)
But when you post something and a couple people that regularly abuse that forum come in and bump an entire page that just ticks me off.
Why not just post a list of stuff that you have for sale?
What next, a post for every individual bio ball you have for sale!?
We SHARE this site, and there are alot of hobbiests that are here to sell/trade stuff at good deals/fair prices or good trades just for fun or love of the hobby, and many do just to help people out.
Is this going to get jacked the same way people now do on craigslist, pages of crap sold by the same hacks only out for the quick buck?
Most on this site are cool, but a few abuse, and really need a lesson on consideration.

[JAHGYDI]

sdcheaps

[vinny73]

Sweet Dave! I was just thinking the same thing! FINALLY, I DON'T HAVE TO BE THE BAD GUY! Rock on Brother!

[rudy]

+1
I like the idea. Post: "Stuff for sale" and then a link to your forum with all the stuff listed.

[Yolo]

Not really that much Dave...I see what you see. There are guys who buy entire systems and piece them out, I have done that occaisionally. Remove those guys and you will see a pretty weak site. These prices are set by the market on this website...

This is still an opportunity...

Now excuse me, I have to prepare my lights for sale as I just bought some new ones last night...

Like junk email, you can always hit the delete key...They do bump their own posts alot but my guess is that's mostly out of boredom.

[davocean]

What ticked me was not bumping a post, no.
It was bumping an entire page of seperate things over and over.
It wasn't just one person like I said, just obvious who the one continuous abuser was since he chose to out himself.
I wasn't going to name anyone, but it is a bummer when you try to do a simple trade only to be knocked back out of site by guys who bump an entire page, and do this daily, or sometimes several times in a day.
I see this on CL all the time(and funny is the abuser here gets flagged all the time there too)
Check for furniture there, and all you see is a bunch of wharehouse adds, and a couple public people tucked here/there and also knocked back pages out of site.
It would be so lame to have that happen here too.

[Yolo]

Know what you mean...I want to go throw a brick through that Adams Ave furniture store for runining the CL Furniture section...was looking for a few chairs, they post every day, 6 different ways...I've been flagging them every time I see them.

I agree with you 100% on that sceanario

[Fine Fins]

Well said Dave, if for example you have a clown pair, a clam, LR, a few PH's and some lights and you post them separately instead of all them together it creates clutter.

[davocean]

Exactly, and it is so easy now to do that w/ the new subtitles below main title.
Most do well about SHARING this site, and don't act like IT'S ALL ABOUT THEM!

[MichaelRyanSD]

Well I might as well chime in here since I'm assuming your talking about me, but before this becomes some big thing over who is right and wrong, let me say that I'm not trying to argue who is right or wrong, because in this situation is just a matter of difference of opinion. So in other words, lets keep this civil.

I should start by saying that all the things you've suggested, I've tried!!, if you look at my forums you'll see I did post things there, the problem is, for pretty much the entire sdreef population these forums end at the reef discussion. Anything below that is usually skipped. I had several things that I posted in there initially, with no luck after 4-5 days I put some in the for sale section....gone that same day.

So basically what this tells me, is people check that for sale section more then they check anything else.

You've also suggested that I consolidate everything into one thread...believe me I wish I could as this is much easier for me. But for whatever reason, if I put the title as "Aquarium Garage Sale" or "Tons of Aquarium Stuff", I get mediocre response. I've literally had to pm people who had posts in the "WTB" who were looking for stuff that was listed in those threads and had the only looked, they would have found it. But for whatever reason unless it says "MH lighting" or "Brain Coral" or w/e the case may be in the title, a good percentage of people just bypass it.

Now moving on, I think your being a little over dramatic about this

here is a search on things I have had for sale in the equipment section (I usually have more equipment for sale then livestock, so I''ll be fair here and use my biggest "offender" as an example

http://www.sdreefs.com/forums/search.php?searchid=676823

Since the beginning of the year, Jan 01, I have had 11 posts in that section...11! that is it. I then checked out the overall history of the equipment section and the thing doesn't even go back to Jan 01, there has been so many posts in its history (15 pages) that it only goes back to Jan 21, so there are 25 posts on a page times 15, comes out to 375, if you go all the way back to jan 01, your looking at probably somewhere around 500 seperate posts.

So your telling me that my 11 posts is somehow the biggest offender, I think if you put it in to perspective, it really ain't all that much. Now to narrow it down, you could say I have 3-4 "active" things I am trying to sell and post out of a page of 25 posts. Why do I bump these things, well as you probably know, most people only check the first page and god forbid they use the search feature. So 4 posts out of 25 and this annoys you?

Moving on, I realize you have no way of telling this, but I do try and be considerate because I am aware of what I am doing, there are people on here who will be selling the same thing as me and literally bump a couple times a day just for the sake of being on top of mine. Talk about inconsiderate and rude...me on the other hand, I typically try and wait till its on page three before I bump it, I'm not going to say never, but usually I wait till at least the bottom of page two or three before I bump it. So Im not sure how I can be anymore considerate then that...Furthermore, I am considerate and do try and consolidate threads when applicable, and good example was when I had ten heaters to sell and did post them all under one thread rather then listing out each on individually because that WOULD be inconsiderate...so its like I dont try

In regards to me trying to make a quick buck, I'll take that as you meaning the bucket of bio balls for 5$, well I'd say look in PIF section or things I given away for free, Im not sure if Im the most generous guy on here, but Id say I have my fair share of PIF's, so obviously Im not trying to make quick buck, because cmon...5$ aint much, its more of, if I put some stuff on there for free (aka bio-balls) then all of a sudden everyone in the world needs bio-balls and I get ten phone calls and 20 pm's about it. Most of which will say they will take it, then flake out....

If by charging 5$, its somehow like they are more serious about taking them....I dunno, I'm not a psychologist.

In closing, if what your saying is that I stop doing what I'm doing all together, or "go somewhere else" then I'd say tell that to the guy who stopped by yesterday and got a pretty much brand new eheim pump for 80$, I'd say tell that to the guys who got a 4" crocea clam for 30$!!!. Id say tell that to the kid who got some LR for me but needed a way to keep it live for a couple days, so I gave him a free pump and bucket. Id say check my feedback and tell that to all the people who've bought stuff of me who were probably glad that I "bumped" something at the right time for them to snag it up. ID SAY TELL THAT to the many people who have returned items to me for pretty much w/e reason ( stopped working after a month, the pump wouldn't fit right, or simply because they just didn't like it...yes I have even accepted returns on aquariums simply because the guy decided he didn't like it)...So think about that, a kid selling stuff from his garage...has a better return policy then any store has ever had..and somehow all of that is inconsiderate?!?!?

[Technoviking]

Before you guys read my post I'm going to admit that I did not read Michael Ryans last post, so take that into consideration in case I cover something he covered or whatever.

See that's my struggle. I would like it for sponsors to post in their own forum (that's why they have it right?) and not the FS section but I can't tell them to do that, they paid for the ability to advertise on the site.

But your right about the single item posting. Most sponsors (members too) have the courtesy to use one post and put everything they have for sale in it. I do not really monitor the FS section (broke so it's just depressing :p) but I guess I need to.

So I guess I'll just start deleting single item threads if the person has more than 2. Obviously you can make a thread in the equipment and the livestock, that doesn't count as your two because they are two different sections.

Sound good?

Also, sometimes I miss threads. If there is a thread you guys really want me to see link me in a PM.

Thanks
Blake

[MichaelRyanSD]

You know, I will try again to start putting everything into one thread again, last time I did, it was hard because all were were allowed was the title, so all I could fit was something like
"Tons of Aquarium Stuff, Heaters,Skimmers,Ligh"

But now with the little red arrow thing I can fit everything I am selling

something like
"Tons of Aqaurium Stuff, Heaters, Skimmers,
>>>Lighting, Powerheads,Calc Reactors, etc"

[Technoviking]

If I were selling a list of stuff I wouldn't even put "Tons..." I would just list as much as I could to grab the most interest.

[MichaelRyanSD]

Maybe you should define it as " A person cant have more then two active threads on the first page of the sales section"

because I might have 4-5 things to sell, but if two or three are on page 2 its not really cluttering things up on the first page (the only page most people look at )

[WRAiTHY]

How about you disable the bumping and make the posts static?

[Two Bit Scooter]

Bump








(couldn't resist :) )

My $0.02, I don't have a problem with lots of threads or bumps... but to add to the conversation:
How about a rule that authors cannot bump their own posts in a well defined time frame (once a day, week, month...) without a significant change to the content (like a price drop)?

[Technoviking]

I see absolutely no problem with bumping. It makes it so people don't post multiple threads of the same garbage and clutter up the site.

[Yolo]

People just need to learn to edit properly. Delete their last "bump" post, then reply with a new one. That way we don't read bump, bump, bump, etc...or they can play games and say" PM'd you, Called you, etc.

One thread with 20 bumps from the OP is fairly annoying, but then again, I guess I can just not look...

[Technoviking]

People just need to learn to edit properly. Delete their last "bump" post, then reply with a new one. That way we don't read bump, bump, bump, etc...or they can play games and say" PM'd you, Called you, etc.

One thread with 20 bumps from the OP is fairly annoying, but then again, I guess I can just not look...

+1

Justin does a very good job of this.

[alex4angela]

I think it would be nice when checking out the for sale section to be able to open it up and see a list of items like skimmers ,lights' sump's etc. sections instead of looking threw all the forums. Basically if I am looking for a skimmer I just look for it in the skimmer section and be able to more easily compare. Alex

[MichaelRyanSD]

Bump








(couldn't resist :) )

My $0.02, I don't have a problem with lots of threads or bumps... but to add to the conversation:
How about a rule that authors cannot bump their own posts in a well defined time frame (once a day, week, month...) without a significant change to the content (like a price drop)?

I'd say once every two days or so is probably about right, if people have to wait a week then the posts will move to like page 5 where no one will ever read it.....and if we only have to wait a day, well thats usually what I do now and I guess some people have a problem with that

[MichaelRyanSD]

+1

Justin does a very good job of this.

hey wheres my kudo's!! I usually keep pretty clean threads :)

[davocean]

Even daily bump doesn't bother me, as long as people don't hog the whole front page w/ ALL adds by them.
I do like the search idea/list.
Thats the other thing, going through 10 pages of same stuff, sold stuff, just to find what you're looking for.
Am I not seeing where to delete an add?

[MichaelRyanSD]

well I guess therein lies the difference of opinion, I don't consider 4 threads as an act of "hogging up" the entire page of 25 threads. I can't necessarily say either what constitutes enough threads to actually be hogging up the entire page, to give it a generalization I'd say somewhere upwards of 15, that is my personal opinion though, again its just me but I didn't think 4 threads (thats only 16%) of the entire page is hogging, but hey I could be wrong...if enough people say it is, then I guess it is...but it has nothing to do with being inconsiderate..

[davocean]

As I have said at least 3 times here, this thread is not just about you.
But for some reason, everyone assumes it is just about you, including yourself.
Something to think about.
If I were a mean person, or here to out you, I would simply post all the PM's I have received thanking me for posting this, as well as their comments, and they all do have your name mentioned.
I am done commenting on this issue.

[MichaelRyanSD]

First off, I realize overall what your getting at and how it applies to a broader spectrum of all people on here in regards to multiple posts...but how can you sit there and tell me "this thread isn't all about you" yet you basically open this entire thread with

"One of the guys I know at least pays for sponsorship, but really, do we need a page full of used bio balls and buckets HOGGING THE ENTIRE FOR SALE SECTION!!!"

So since you didn't mention any names, yet your pretty much layed it out there who it was and it went like this....one guy...pays for sponsorship...is selling bio-balls. So dont think because you didn't mention any names you didn't indirectly place the onus of blame on an individual.
That is basically the equivalent of someone who goes up to another person and says "with all due respect...then tells them whatever the f they want" and their justification is "I gave you all due respect"

I cant just send a letter to the CIA telling them how I'm going to assassinate this black guy who is the leader of the free world and he lives in Washington...and then when they come bust down my door, use the excuse "what!!! I didn't say his name directly"

So anyways moving on from that, I don't know how we've derived to this point, but maybe if you read through my entire you posts, you would see the part where it says " I don't think your necessarily Wrong and I'm right" and to further if you read the subsequent thread, you would see I was engaged in active dialogue to resolve this...if it is a problem, lets fix it! As I said before and I'll say again (I'll even go bold so its abundantly clear) THIS IS JUST DIFFERENCE OF OPINION, NOT WHO IS RIGHT OR WRONG. Its not like you or anybody else sent me a pm saying " Hey your multiple postings are kind of bothering me when there up top a lot, can we work something out so it doesn't become a big deal" and my response probably would have been " Hmm, I didn't realize it was a problem, yeah let me see what i can do". and that way it could have been kept private and civil...ohh wait I forgot, you were talking about the guy who pays for sponsorship and is selling bio-balls..but you didn't name any names....

In regards to you insinuating that I am making it "all about me"...well there are only 5-10 people here who are in the same boat as I am and its not like I have their telephone numbers so I can see how they feel about the whole subject...all I can do is..SPEAK FOR MYSELF...so if somehow giving you my opinion makes it all about me, then i don't know what to tell you...I mean I don't know what you were expecting when you make a post like this in the public and not expect those directly affected to give you their opinion back. I sure as heck welcome other people that are directly affected to speak up, but as I said before, I can only speak for myself..

Another thing, the only thing I took slightly personal is how you basically said me and who ever else you are referring to as inconsiderate jerks basically..and to that I gave you my initial response.

I DON'T KNOW HOW TO BE ANY MORE CONSIDERATE, FOLLOWING MY INITIAL POST I ENGAGED IN ACTIVE DIALOGUE WITH BLAKE IN PUBLIC ON RULES THAT WOULD NEGATIVELY AFFECT ME..I EVEN SUPPORTED A RULE THAT WOULD NEGATIVELY AFFECT ME

As far as your " I've got pms of people who thank me..."... I say make it public, let it be known. I am pretty sure some of those people have bought off me before, so that makes them hypocrites because basically what it is saying is, they don't like me having a few active threads on here...unless its something they want to buy!! As far as the remaining people...maybe they should post their comments here..this is a discussion after all

The only thing that does bug me though is how you referred to it as "Taking over an entire page" and "by guys who bump an entire page"

I dont know how to break it down anymore...4 posts are 16% of the entire page (100%).

16% and 100% are pretty much and opposite ends of the spectrum

Something I didn't say initially which I should have said, and I will say it now...if my bumping threads up bothers people, then I'm sorry, its a mistake and I wasn't aware it was a problem...Im sorry


But you know what, I have a feeling that wont be good enough, which is evident in the fact that after your first post (which was a legitimate issue and needed to be dealt with) the subsequent posts were basically a rehashing of the one preceding it, only being more malicious then the previous.. I have a feeling you and whoever else sent you a pm wont be satisfied until you run me and whoever else your "referring" to...butt's up a flag pole.

So in closing, lets work out a conclusion that everyone can agree on....

[Titan]

I am a kind and mature person who would never insult someone for no reason and try to start drama. :)

[RussM]

Frankly, I don't give a hoot what forum a sponsor posts in... I don't even browse by forum unless I'm going back looking for something specific. 'New Posts' is a wonderful feature, and normally my first click upon entering SDReefs. Most of the time, when reading a post, I don't pay any attention to what forum it's in, and really don't care. And threads with a generic "stuff for sale" subject don't interest me.... I'll usually pass right by them, unless the OP is someone I know. I'd rather see a thread title that has a clear concise subject/title that lists what's for sale (or is wanted to buy, or what help is needed, etc.).... that's what will get my attention. And if that means a post for a skimmer, a post for LR, and a post for a sump all in the same day from the same person, so be it - I have no issue with that.

Starting each SDReefs session with 'New Posts' and ending it with 'Mark All Forums Read' is a technique I highly recommend to allow getting the most useful content with minimal effort and time.

But I do have to agree that the frequent bumps done by some people are quite annoying.

And if anyone find another user's posts bothersome, then just use the Ignore feature, and quit whining.

[Two Bit Scooter]

Starting each SDReefs session with 'New Posts' and ending it with 'Mark All Forums Read' is a technique I highly recommend to allow getting the most useful content with minimal effort and time.
<snip>
And if anyone find another user's posts bothersome, then just use the Ignore feature, and quit whining.

+1, but then again the drama is just so much darn fun...

[davocean]

Look, I posted one simple trade.
w/in minutes it gets buried in back pages by a couple guys that have a string of posts they constantly post over and over.
These are not new posts.
If I didn't have a trade posted, yes, easy to ignore.
But it's annoying when people constantly put a list of posts knocking everyone out of site.
It was more than 4 posts, more than once.
I know you make a living this way mike, I know you pay sponsorship, and while it can be annoying to see nothing but adds by you, I know you pay for it, reason why I stated that.
It wasn't just you doing this.
I'm just saying it would be nice to do simple trades/sales here.
I know you understand what I mean when I point out what has happened to craiglist being taken over by people doing this for a living, and squeezing out the private sales, making it difficult to find the deals that it was originally created for, and I hope that doesn't happen here.
So, I pointed this out for that reason, and Techno can do what he thinks is best for this site.

[Yolo]

"never argue with a fool, bystanders may not be able to tell the difference" - Mark Twain

[davocean]

LOL. I like it!

[MichaelRyanSD]

So now that its been a couple days to cool off about this I'd like to say again that I am sorry if multiple posts were bothering you and that it wasn't because I am some little inconsiderate punk kid, its simple because I didn't know.

Had you dave, or anyone else sent me a pm I would have definitely respected your wishes and do my best to rectify the situation.

I realize you made the post public because it applies to other people as well and I was sort of the catalyst to you making that post.

I just want you to know that its wasn't because I'm inconsiderate or a jerk, really its simply that its not something that bothers me when other people do it. But just because other people do it and are ok with it (like RussM and how he posted how he feels) doesn't mean it won't bother other people.

I can't speak for the other sponsors, or offenders, but I'll try and be more aware of it and do what I can to make it right...

[HandyCaptPuffer]

Second the "new post feature"

In all honesty I am an easily disturbed guy and so far since I have been on here since 2004.

I haven't been bothered by any of this.

I don't normally sell or buy on here, but I do always view what being sold.

After looking for other reefs sites in CA, this is still the one that occupies my time.

So with that said, most must enjoy it, just the way it is.