Max 2017!

[MadMax]

http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii46/reefmeister2/Random/MAX2017banner1024x133.jpg

Hi Folks,

The official 10th Anniversary for the Marine Aquarium Expo is coming next April!

Please reserve the dates of April 1 - 2, 2017 at the OC Fair & Event Center

We have MANY changes in store for you, details of which we are still being worked out and will be announced later. The entire show format will change to better reflect what the hobbyist community wants and needs from a show like MAX. We know you will be very pleased with the results!

We will add information as it becomes available, so check back often.

Thank you for your support and participation these past 10 years; we strive to keep you entertained, informed, and intrigued!

[MadMax]

Please offer some suggestions in this thread as to what changes or additions you would like to see for MAX 2017.

[jessegarcia28]

No changes except we need a beer garden...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[gus6464]

The reason I got to things like max and rap is to see cool gear not people who grow coral in their garage and then sell their tiny frags for ridiculous amounts. I only went this year because I wanted to see the SOS Zaya in action and bought one at the show. There was nothing else to do after that and was only there for an hour tops.

[MadMax]

The reason I got to things like max and rap is to see cool gear not people who grow coral in their garage and then sell their tiny frags for ridiculous amounts. I only went this year because I wanted to see the SOS Zaya in action and bought one at the show. There was nothing else to do after that and was only there for an hour tops.

I hear you, and fully understand. The tough part is trying to please as many people as possible with those resources that are available to us. I too would like to see more innovative products displayed. Even more so I'd like to see more affordable livestock offered. .

[F-Dawg]

Looking Forward To The Event ;)

[VW REEFS]

its a great show we always have a good time there, if not for anything else just to catch up with all the friends we have made over the last few years doing this show...........

[CMD2213]

its a great show we always have a good time there, if not for anything else just to catch up with all the friends we have made over the last few years doing this show...........
Or you can be like me go out there to buy stuff from Vance lol....
I get things from various ppl but always end up buying a majority from Vance. What can I say... I am a loyal SDR MEMBER.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Yes, Vance is one of our best exhibitors. His livestock is reasonably priced and so he did very well in sales. Many others should follow his example. Those who overprice their corals obviously do not do well at any show.

[cutterx23]

Those who overprice the cost of their event tend to not have a very good event. I spoke to a vast majority of vendors who were very underwhelmed with the production of this event. And as an attendee and exhibitor over the last few years I have watched the attendance drop year after year as well as the quality of the vendors. There is a reason why you are now trying to make sweeping changes to the whole event. I will likely be banned from future MAX shows as a result of this post, kinda like what happened to Reefer's Garage, but to try to back hand insult the vendors that pay for this event to be held comes across as highly disrespectfully.

[CMD2213]

I haven't felt the urge to go lately as I have access to cutterx23 tuna_bullet reefers garage and other as my lfs/suplliers. Things have been so so over time and only thing I really look forward to is MACNA.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[pirate2876]

Those who overprice the cost of their event tend to not have a very good event. I spoke to a vast majority of vendors who were very underwhelmed with the production of this event. And as an attendee and exhibitor over the last few years I have watched the attendance drop year after year as well as the quality of the vendors. There is a reason why you are now trying to make sweeping changes to the whole event. I will likely be banned from future MAX shows as a result of this post, kinda like what happened to Reefer's Garage, but to try to back hand insult the vendors that pay for this event to be held comes across as highly disrespectfully.

Well said.

[chireef]

Those who overprice the cost of their event tend to not have a very good event. I spoke to a vast majority of vendors who were very underwhelmed with the production of this event. And as an attendee and exhibitor over the last few years I have watched the attendance drop year after year as well as the quality of the vendors. There is a reason why you are now trying to make sweeping changes to the whole event. I will likely be banned from future MAX shows as a result of this post, kinda like what happened to Reefer's Garage, but to try to back hand insult the vendors that pay for this event to be held comes across as highly disrespectfully.

I have to agree with cutters . This post isn't no disrespect to the event or to mad max just a genuine statement from the voice.of all surrounding hobbyist. Hope things can change and this event can be a awesome event once again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dizzle21]

Those who overprice the cost of their event tend to not have a very good event. I spoke to a vast majority of vendors who were very underwhelmed with the production of this event. And as an attendee and exhibitor over the last few years I have watched the attendance drop year after year as well as the quality of the vendors. There is a reason why you are now trying to make sweeping changes to the whole event. I will likely be banned from future MAX shows as a result of this post, kinda like what happened to Reefer's Garage, but to try to back hand insult the vendors that pay for this event to be held comes across as highly disrespectfully.

You won't be banned, but I'm sure this post will get deleted just like every other post in this thread Kevin has deleted.

[MadMax]

Those who overprice the cost of their event tend to not have a very good event. I spoke to a vast majority of vendors who were very underwhelmed with the production of this event. And as an attendee and exhibitor over the last few years I have watched the attendance drop year after year as well as the quality of the vendors. There is a reason why you are now trying to make sweeping changes to the whole event. I will likely be banned from future MAX shows as a result of this post, kinda like what happened to Reefer's Garage, but to try to back hand insult the vendors that pay for this event to be held comes across as highly disrespectfully.

I see nothing wrong with this post. You haven't a clue of what you are talking about, but it is at least respectable. Nobody knows what goes on behind the scenes except the promoter himself, so what have you to gain by pretending to have expert knowledge? That being said, you are correct on one very important account. Our attendance the last two years has been declined; but for some strange reason the theme of your post seems more inclined to demeaning the promoter instead of helping the promoter create a better show. Why is this and what is your intention? Do you wish to see the MAX show disappear entirely?

[jason142]

Any post that has nothing to do with suggesting changes or additions will be deleted. This is not an attack or bashing thread no matter what other members opinions may be so let's ALL be respectful.

[SDguy]

I personally don't think this is the venue to discuss exhibitor and promoter issues, especially money. Those are business dealings that the folks on this forum will not light torches and carry pitchforks for, and shouldn't. Produce a great show, with great exhibitors, and the reef community will attend. How you do it, and how the exhibitors handle it, is not my problem... but don't mud sling here about it.

[MadMax]

I personally don't think this is the venue to discuss exhibitor and promoter issues, especially money. Those are business dealings that the folks on this forum will not light torches and carry pitchforks for, and shouldn't. Produce a great show, with great exhibitors, and the reef community will attend. How you do it is not my problem... don't mud sling here about it.

Thanks Peter, you are 100% correct. (and thank you, Jason) We do what we do for the vast majority of people who love MAX, now lets find ways to make it better

[borg]

Im relatively new to the hobby and Ive never been to Max. I really wanted to go this past year but honestly, i got turned off of what happened to RG and the posts that you had on SCR. You're the promoter and I don't know what happened behind the scenes so I only know what I read on both forums. I didn't want to support the promoter so maybe shame on me.

The feedback that I'm seeing here is that attendance is decreasing. Perhaps its time to look at how you promote yourself. Obviously, I don't know you so you could be the nicest person in the world, but if you play the villain in these forums, we get to see the bad guy. From my perspective, I simply don't want to support that.

If you're looking for a suggestion, it sounds like you need to get more people to attend the event, so Id start with the way you present yourself in the forums and be more likable. More people attending will likely mean the event is more successful. If I like the promoter, I would make a point to attend. Again, one guy's opinion, but Id bet that some people think the way I do.

[MadMax]

Im relatively new to the hobby and Ive never been to Max. I really wanted to go this past year but honestly, i got turned off of what happened to RG and the posts that you had on SCR. You're the promoter and I don't know what happened behind the scenes so I only know what I read on both forums. I didn't want to support the promoter so maybe shame on me.

The feedback that I'm seeing here is that attendance is decreasing. Perhaps its time to look at how you promote yourself. Obviously, I don't know you so you could be the nicest person in the world, but if you play the villain in these forums, we get to see the bad guy. From my perspective, I simply don't want to support that.

If you're looking for a suggestion, it sounds like you need to get more people to attend the event, so Id start with the way you present yourself in the forums and be more likable. More people attending will likely mean the event is more successful. If I like the promoter, I would make a point to attend. Again, one guy's opinion, but Id bet that some people think the way I do.

Hi borg (sorry, I do not know your real name)
I appreciate your advice, but with all due respect I will not discuss personal character traits and/or private business issues on the internet.
Sorry if this seems rude but it is an unfortunate necessity.

[VW REEFS]

gotta say the cost is fine for the event as a vendor the problem like many events people commit and put a small down payment and don't pay there bills on time, and for putting on a event its not cheap and commitments have to be paid in advanced. there is always two sides to every story its best to put yourself in the shoes of others to realize there's more than meets the eye. Kevin is straight forward not a lot of BS there.

[russ13]

I've been to a few shows in my time. I went to the first or second max show. I think it was in 2009 or 2010. So I may not be up to date. When I was there I didn't see a lot of big venders showing of there new equipment. I would like to see Neptune systems, Tunze, and ecosystems with spots showing there newest products. I helped a friend work a booth and got to meet a lot of cool people. I even met people who flew in from out of state just to attend the show. It was a great experience and I would recommend checking it out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

gotta say the cost is fine for the event as a vendor the problem like many events people commit and put a small down payment and don't pay there bills on time, and for putting on a event its not cheap and commitments have to be paid in advanced. there is always two sides to every story its best to put yourself in the shoes of others to realize there's more than meets the eye. Kevin is straight forward not a lot of BS there.

Thank you very much Vance, you pretty much hit the nail on the head! Very few people realize what all is involved.

[chireef]

So isn't this thread finished because everything that goes on at MAX is only things taken care of behind the scenes? It doesn't really matter what the locals think we are just hoping to get a good impression of it and make our choice whether we want to show or not. So I wish next years Max good luck.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

So isn't this thread finished because everything that goes on at MAX is only things taken care of behind the scenes? It doesn't really matter what the locals think we are just hoping to get a good impression of it and make our choice whether we want to show or not. So I wish next years Max good luck.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The purpose of this thread is to brain-storm ideas that might help make MAX a better show.

After 10 years it is very difficult to keep things fresh and exciting for any show in any industry; such problem is only magnified further in one as niche and specialized as ours.

Simply presenting a good impression and hoping for the best is no longer sufficient. We have much more research to conduct before making any final decisions.

I do hope we can bring all of you a 10th anniversary show but this is no where near guaranteed at this point in time. I am personally neutral either way.

[sushi]

It sounds like a lot of people want to see a lot of equipment vendors there to show their newest stuff, which I would also be interested in. Frags I can get anywhere, and I'd rather get 'em from people here who have a good reputation, but seeing new equipment and tanks and all that would be something interesting and new to me. That's just my feeling, I am sure others enjoy buying corals and such as well. If you can snag people from the manufacturers we all know and see on sites like Marine Depot and they show their latest innovations it would be quite an interesting exhibition indeed.

[MadMax]

It sounds like a lot of people want to see a lot of equipment vendors there to show their newest stuff, which I would also be interested in. Frags I can get anywhere, and I'd rather get 'em from people here who have a good reputation, but seeing new equipment and tanks and all that would be something interesting and new to me. That's just my feeling, I am sure others enjoy buying corals and such as well. If you can snag people from the manufacturers we all know and see on sites like Marine Depot and they show their latest innovations it would be quite an interesting exhibition indeed.

Thanks Sushi,
I agree with you 100%, and thus far this is my favorite post (sorry Vince, gotta knock you into 2nd place, man, LOL)
I too personally find the most value in seeing "the latest and greatest" from our manufacturers. I'd also like to see more live demonstrations and workshops hosted by company reps in their booths.
Then seeing the products available for sale at significant "show discount" would just be the cherry on top! Such is alot to ask though given that these companies cannot normally sell direct to the public without cannibalizing their own distribution channels, so what we normally see are showcasing of new product instead of sales.

[sushi]

Thanks Sushi,
I agree with you 100%, and thus far this is my favorite post (sorry Vince, gotta knock you into 2nd place, man, LOL)
I too personally find the most value in seeing "the latest and greatest" from our manufacturers. I'd also like to see more live demonstrations and workshops hosted by company reps in their booths.
Then seeing the products available for sale at significant "show discount" would just be the cherry on top! Such is alot to ask though given that these companies cannot normally sell direct to the public without cannibalizing their own distribution channels, so what we normally see are showcasing of new product instead of sales.

That definitely makes sense. If the manufacturers gave big discounts no one would buy from the distributors anymore. They would just wait for MAX like people wait for cyber Monday :lol:

Distributors like Marine Depot and BRS could give discounts without much harm, but I am pretty new to the hobby and have no idea if many retailers go to these shows. As for wants and needs, in my fantasy world it would be cool to see manufacturers showcasing new products and retailers there with nice sales. That's surely difficult to orchestrate if not impossible, but I do think that'd get people excited.

[russ13]

Is that what the MAcNA show is???


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Is that what the MAcNA show is???


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The same issues apply for the MACNA conference. I should point out that sometimes (all shows) a manufacturer may team up with an exhibiting retailer to sell a particular product. This is on rare occasion though.

[MadMax]

That definitely makes sense. If the manufacturers gave big discounts no one would buy from the distributors anymore. They would just wait for MAX like people wait for cyber Monday :lol:

Distributors like Marine Depot and BRS could give discounts without much harm, but I am pretty new to the hobby and have no idea if many retailers go to these shows. As for wants and needs, in my fantasy world it would be cool to see manufacturers showcasing new products and retailers there with nice sales. That's surely difficult to orchestrate if not impossible, but I do think that'd get people excited.

We do get some retailers, however it is tough sell to many store owners who have few employees and thus can't man a booth for an entire weekend. They generally do not want to close their stores during the show because the weekends are their bread and butter, and even worse some even consider these shows as competition instead of a positive opportunity. The irony is that the few retailers who do exhibit do extremely well in sales and some even get a boat load of free stuff at the end of the show from manufacturers who don't want to truck their stuff back across the country. I would love to get more stores involved because of sales at our show help the show, our promotions help their store, and the hobby community get to see/buy their stuff....its win-win! Not as easy as it sounds though trying to convince an owner that MAX is in his/her best interests., until they try it, .

[moon doggy1]

I like to second sushi I am a equipment junkie and want to see and touch all of the things that are never at stores, I rather buy my corals local, better success. PS I have been to your show for many years, and big guys want lots of attendance, so maybe make the entrance price 10 dollars and make it cheap for the wife and kids to get in as well. My 2 cents.

[MadMax]

I like to second sushi I am a equipment junkie and want to see and touch all of the things that are never at stores, I rather buy my corals local, better success. PS I have been to your show for many years, and big guys want lots of attendance, so maybe make the entrance price 10 dollars and make it cheap for the wife and kids to get in as well. My 2 cents.

Hi Moon doggy,
The irony is that I had a few business people years ago suggest that the entrance price of MAX should be significantly MORE; stating that a $15 entrance charge somehow cheapens the show. I didn't agree with them then and I don't agree with them now. You will happy to know we are seriously considering a $10 entrance fee for the next MAX show as part of our new reform/changes. I am also attempting to move our show to the Huntington Beach building (not confirmed yet) so as to be closer to the swap meet and hence people can take advantage of free parking on that side of the fair grounds. (this saves another $8 per car)

I always refused to charge even a dime for children (kids 12 and under have always been FREE) I should also point out that everything you've ever seen having to do with the kids (Touch Tank, Float-Your-Boat, HD Theater, Contests, Prizes, etc.) have always come straight our own pocket. Given that none of these things are revenue producing activities, I think you can imagine how the charges add up and up and up. The float-your-boat contest in 2015 cost me over $5gs alone to build (I took it all on myself both physically and financially, building this 10-foot long racing pool literally one week prior to the show)).....in 2016 we tried to find a sponsor to at least cover the costs of materials and prizes, but unfortunately nobody came through, so we had to cancel it altogether. I simply couldn't afford to throw away another $2gs, even after the enduring the sunk costs from the previous year. (It killed me then to make that decision and I regretted it even more later after seeing kids showing up at MAX expecting to sign up for Float-Your-Boat) Perhaps if more word got out about it some business would be willing to help. Its always an ROI thing for business people to consider.

I bring this up so as to give people a very small snapshot of what goes on behind the scenes and this is constitutes perhaps 1/50th of the show. My wife and I have been doing this for 10 years now!
To then listen to someone state comments like "I don't want to support the promoter"??????? I want people to revisit the first few posts in this thread and see the mentality of what we have to deal with.
BTW: as a non-profit we are not directly affected by attendance anyway so I'm not exactly sure where that logic is going.

(EDIT):
PLEASE REMEMBER. Today we honor those who have sacrificed their lives so that you and I can do what we are doing at this very moment!
Honor Them, Remember Them, and Forever Keep Them in your minds and hearts....
Happy Memorial Day Everyone!

[CMD2213]

Well all the effort put in is appreciated. Hopefully whatever changes are needed are eventually made, and any issues brought up will no longer an issue in the near future. We all love our reeftanks/communities and all of those who help the growth and evolution of this hobby.
I'll eventually go to Max again but having a 2nd kid on the way work being off and on kind of priorities over addiction.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Well all the effort put in is appreciated. Hopefully whatever changes are needed are eventually made, and any issues brought up will no longer an issue in the near future. We all love our reeftanks/communities and all of those who help the growth and evolution of this hobby.
I'll eventually go to Max again but having a 2nd kid on the way work being off and on kind of priorities over addiction.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk


You're Darned STRAIGHT that is a higher priority!!! Congratulations man!!

I pledge by the time he or she is 5-years old that I'll have the "MAX 3D Underwater Virtual-Reality Sub Visit To the Grand Cayman Wall Extravaganza" Fully Operational!!!






(I'm dreaming of course, no such thing will take place, sigh! but it does sound cool, right? : )

[DaveMorris]

As a professional in the convention and tradeshow industry I can tell you that what Kevin is going through to try to revitalize MAX is a very common situation. People are finicky and get bored and then demand something new and flashy. If the show needs updating then Kevin is taking the correct track to reach out to folks who typically attend to seek out what they want. What is it that you as an attendee want to see in place that will get you to go next year? As the Co-Chair of MACNA, we are dealing with that on a much larger scale. We are trying to put into place different things to get more exhibitors. Some companies don't want to exhibit because of a bad exhibitor experience last year or the year before. So we as MACNA promoters have to address those concerns. MAX is no different. I applaud Kevin for reading out to people to get their ideas. It can be an embarrassing and humbling experience to do that sometimes. It sounds like it is more important to Kevin to put on a good show than it is to worry about people complaining about things. Hopefully he can find the right solutions and produce the show for another ten years. We can never have too many reef shows!

[borg]

I always refused to charge even a dime for children (kids 12 and under have always been FREE) I should also point out that everything you've ever seen having to do with the kids (Touch Tank, Float-Your-Boat, HD Theater, Contests, Prizes, etc.) have always come straight our own pocket. Given that none of these things are revenue producing activities, I think you can imagine how the charges add up and up and up. The float-your-boat contest in 2015 cost me over $5gs alone to build (I took it all on myself both physically and financially, building this 10-foot long racing pool literally one week prior to the show)).....in 2016 we tried to find a sponsor to at least cover the costs of materials and prizes, but unfortunately nobody came through, so we had to cancel it altogether. I simply couldn't afford to throw away another $2gs, even after the enduring the sunk costs from the previous year. (It killed me then to make that decision and I regretted it even more later after seeing kids showing up at MAX expecting to sign up for Float-Your-Boat) Perhaps if more word got out about it some business would be willing to help. Its always an ROI thing for business people to consider.

I bring this up so as to give people a very small snapshot of what goes on behind the scenes and this is constitutes perhaps 1/50th of the show. My wife and I have been doing this for 10 years now!
To then listen to someone state comments like "I don't want to support the promoter"??????? I want people to revisit the first few posts in this thread and see the mentality of what we have to deal with.
BTW: as a non-profit we are not directly affected by attendance anyway so I'm not exactly sure where that logic is going.


I was gonna leave alone, but if you dont understand where Im from then I have to explain briefly.

Your post above is what we need to read about though instead of the negativity and rudeness that comes out of your posts hence you get the mentality like mine. This isn't a preconceived notion, but rather a cause and effect issue.

If attendance is decreasing then I would think that vendors would eventually not sign up for the show. Thats my logic.

Some people will always support events like these regardless of who promotes the show and thats great because I agree, shows like these are good for the reefing community. Unfortunately though, there are some that wont support it because of who promotes it so its up to you if you want to change the "mentality" like mine.

If not, its all good.

[MadMax]

I was gonna leave alone, but if you dont understand where Im from then I have to explain briefly.

Your post above is what we need to read about though instead of the negativity and rudeness that comes out of your posts hence you get the mentality like mine. This isn't a preconceived notion, but rather a cause and effect issue.

If attendance is decreasing then I would think that vendors would eventually not sign up for the show. Thats my logic.

Some people will always support events like these regardless of who promotes the show and thats great because I agree, shows like these are good for the reefing community. Unfortunately though, there are some that wont support it because of who promotes it so its up to you if you want to change the "mentality" like mine.

If not, its all good.


And so if I am understanding you correctly (and forgive me if I am wrong)
The MAX show, the vendors, the raffles, the livestock, the fellow hobbyists, etc. didn't capture your emotions
But me and some guy bantering back-and-forth on SCR, that was the bench mark of your decision-making?

Man, you gotta understand, that is pretty insulting to see 10-years of volunteer effort thrown down the toilet as if it never existed....
and you expect me to prove my character now? Is that what you guys are expecting????

[MadMax]

As a professional in the convention and tradeshow industry I can tell you that what Kevin is going through to try to revitalize MAX is a very common situation. People are finicky and get bored and then demand something new and flashy. If the show needs updating then Kevin is taking the correct track to reach out to folks who typically attend to seek out what they want. What is it that you as an attendee want to see in place that will get you to go next year? As the Co-Chair of MACNA, we are dealing with that on a much larger scale. We are trying to put into place different things to get more exhibitors. Some companies don't want to exhibit because of a bad exhibitor experience last year or the year before. So we as MACNA promoters have to address those concerns. MAX is no different. I applaud Kevin for reading out to people to get their ideas. It can be an embarrassing and humbling experience to do that sometimes. It sounds like it is more important to Kevin to put on a good show than it is to worry about people complaining about things. Hopefully he can find the right solutions and produce the show for another ten years. We can never have too many reef shows!


Dave, the one main thing that keeps me going is a rudimentary understanding that your sentiments represent the majority opinion.
Lets all hope this is correct. Thank you very much for your post. New favorite for me.

[Squid]

Have you posted this on other forums? You might be able to get some more responses and feedback on some of the other more active and larger forums.

[borg]

Unfortunately, it does. We live in a world where there are reviews of your work (or your behavior) are on the internet. What Ive seen is that your banned from SCR (a reef forum local to you), the thread about a vendor here, your banter with posters on SCR. Yes, unfortunately that does sway my opinion of supporting an event promoted by you.

Heres an analogy that I can think of. Think of any product that you want to purchase online. I will read the reviews if the product is great, customer service is great, any information i can get from it. I also look at the dates on those reviews. If negative reviews were written years ago and have improved then im more likely to buy that product. If the negative reviews were written more recently, then ill generally stay away. Same with other services (restaurants, stores, etc).

I apologize if youre insulted, but just because youve done 10-years of volunteer effort doesnt mean you have the right to be rude to people.

I likely wont change the way you feel which is fine. However, Im telling you that you can actually change the way I feel.

[MadMax]

Unfortunately, it does. We live in a world where there are reviews of your work (or your behavior) are on the internet. What Ive seen is that your banned from SCR (a reef forum local to you), the thread about a vendor here, your banter with posters on SCR. Yes, unfortunately that does sway my opinion of supporting an event promoted by you.

Heres an analogy that I can think of. Think of any product that you want to purchase online. I will read the reviews if the product is great, customer service is great, any information i can get from it. I also look at the dates on those reviews. If negative reviews were written years ago and have improved then im more likely to buy that product. If the negative reviews were written more recently, then ill generally stay away. Same with other services (restaurants, stores, etc).

I apologize if youre insulted, but just because youve done 10-years of volunteer effort doesnt mean you have the right to be rude to people.

I likely wont change the way you feel which is fine. However, Im telling you that you can actually change the way I feel.

I like you analogy because i do the EXACT same thing as you with Amazon and other sites similar.

Except here is the differnce: Rational Skepticism

I understand there are COMPETITORS who's only agenda is to leave negative feedback (did I hit a bell just now?)

I look at the number or posts and the content of those post in order to come to a logical conclusion.
for instance if the person rating the products cheif complaint is that the shipment was late or his particular item was busted upon arrival, what relevance does that have towards the manufactures quality???
More importantly, if less than a dozen people complain that their product was blemished, yet tens of thousands of the product was sold to mostly happy customers....I'm going to consider that a pretty good risk.

So, now, given that some 20-something year old kid is bashing our show and I'm trying to protect our hard working exhibitors from his trash (perhaps not in the way you would like) you resolutely conclude that the entire show is not worthy of your time??? Or a business vendor who didn't like the fact that I wouldn't sell him a hobby table goes on a rampage and posts all our private e-mails, that's an "AH HAAAA!" moment fo you??? No, its just a disgruntled vendor lashing out with the only authority he has available to him. (the internet) You should recognize this, even if you're not a promoter. I deal with over 200 clients in a given year, NATURALLY one or two are going to be upset over something. ONE percent of the population (2 people out of 200) is no where near sufficient evidence to come to such a conclusion. If nothing else, weigh the credibility of the participants.: Could I Have gotten this far if I was simply some twit with an ego to support?

If nothing else....IF NOTHING ELSE, respect the fact that I (literally a humble/hobbyist/blue-collar/disabled/middle-aged man and nothing more) come here to discuss these things in the open. What do you typically get from ANYONE elese in similar instances? SILENCE

Silence is a convenient Cowards Shelter in my book.

[chireef]

I like you analogy because i do the EXACT same thing as you with Amazon and other sites similar.

Except here is the differnce: Rational Skepticism

I understand there are COMPETITORS who's only agenda is to leave negative feedback (did I hit a bell just now?)

I look at the number or posts and the content of those post in order to come to a logical conclusion.
for instance if the person rating the products cheif complaint is that the shipment was late or his particular item was busted upon arrival, what relevance does that have towards the manufactures quality???
More importantly, if less than a dozen people complain that their product was blemished, yet tens of thousands of the product was sold to mostly happy customers....I'm going to consider that a pretty good risk.

So, now, given that some 20-something year old kid is bashing our show and I'm trying to protect our hard working exhibitors from his trash (perhaps not in the way you would like) you resolutely conclude that the entire show is not worthy of your time??? Or a business vendor who didn't like the fact that I wouldn't sell him a hobby table goes on a rampage and posts all our private e-mails, that's an "AH HAAAA!" moment fo you??? No, its just a disgruntled vendor lashing out with the only authority he has available to him. (the internet) You should recognize this, even if you're not a promoter. I deal with over 200 clients in a given year, NATURALLY one or two are going to be upset over something. ONE percent of the population (2 people out of 200) is no where near sufficient evidence to come to such a conclusion. If nothing else, weigh the credibility of the participants.: Could I Have gotten this far if I was simply some twit with an ego to support?

Well what happened on SCR and also the situation with our local reef shop that many of us have good relationship with did sway me not to go this year . Left a not so good taste in my mouth. And from the responses from my fellow buddies that went it seems that the last show was also affected with low attendance maybe those situations being part of the reason . I do hope to go next year and see the freshness you come up with for Max 2017. Good luck sir


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Have you posted this on other forums? You might be able to get some more responses and feedback on some of the other more active and larger forums.

Yes, we participate in 11 different forums, though I have not yet started any other threads except on Reef2Reef at this point. We have not decided 100% yet whether there will be a show in 2017

[MadMax]

Well what happened on SCR and also the situation with our local reef shop that many of us have good relationship with did sway me not to go this year . Left a not so good taste in my mouth. And from the responses from my fellow buddies that went it seems that the last show was also affected with low attendance maybe those situations being part of the reason . I do hope to go next year and see the freshness you come up with for Max 2017. Good luck sir

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

That is the ray of hope I was looking for. Thank you for considering what I had to say and not ALL simply what your buddy's think.

Promoter's Lives Matter! : )

[borg]

Ok, fine. Ill cave. Ill think about it going next year pending on what changes you make :).

Shake hands and call it a day?

(one last note, I swear. You should read your own comments on SCR and your own emails to the vendor. Perhaps think about handling it a better next time).

[CMD2213]

Ok fellas so let's focus on MACNA THIS YEAR and MAX next year if I'm working and done having kids lol. I'm going to max next year I like to get out and if the fees drop to 10 bucks sweet that's 10 bucks. Saved. From 2 rickets towards another frag and hopefully we can just get these events to their maximum potential bringing the latest and greatest!

As for the BAN of members is there a reconsideration of certain lfs/vendors like I would love to see our lfs reefers garage out there. Showing the other cities/states what we have to offer I know Vance alone does a kick ass job but we need all of our guys out there.

As for bans there should be a actual process to it, rather than someone disliked a certain issue that ends in banning. Due process!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Ok, fine. Ill cave. Ill think about it going next year pending on what changes you make :).

Shake hands and call it a day?

(one last note, I swear. You should read your own comments on SCR and your own emails to the vendor. Perhaps think about handling it a better next time).


If you were to ask me for a complete list of my flaws....
I'd have to ask you first, do you want it in Alphabetical or Chronological order? ;)

[MadMax]

Ok fellas so let's focus on MACNA THIS YEAR and MAX next year if I'm working and done having kids lol. I'm going to max next year I like to get out and if the fees drop to 10 bucks sweet that's 10 bucks. Saved. From 2 rickets towards another frag and hopefully we can just get these events to their maximum potential bringing the latest and greatest!

As for the BAN of members is there a reconsideration of certain lfs/vendors like I would love to see our lfs reefers garage out there. Showing the other cities/states what we have to offer I know Vance alone does a kick ass job but we need all of our guys out there.

As for bans there should be a actual process to it, rather than someone disliked a certain issue that ends in banning. Due process!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G870A using Tapatalk

Just to explain (not inflame)..
When I work my tail off for free so that someone can come in to make money at our show.....
Let's just say I expect at least a minimal of respect (not much, but some) and when they don't, they get the boot. (well, not literally, Sigh! but I act REALLY meannnn)

I agree this doesn't justify a "Get-Out-Of-Jail-And-Act-Like-An-Ass-For-Free-Card" BUT....
I think the expectation of some minimal respect is self-evident in this case.
wouldn't you agree?



BTW, the acronym for that is GOOJAALAAFF if anyone is wity enough to run with it (I've got nothing, LOL)

[ReefersGarage]

List of suggestions

Get rid of the pirate, Pirate's of the Caribbean is a bit out dated...Try a nemo and Dori costume character
Lower the prices of exhibitor booths bringing livestock. The vendors can then in turn lower prices driving hype and customers to the event.
Most all hype for the show comes from LIVESTOCK vendors posting in local forums the items they are bringing to the show.
Try to get free parking
Lower the cost of entry fee IE:
Senior discounts
Military Discounts
Family Rates
We think with a ten dollar entry you could drive many more people to the show.
Food Trucks for guest

[sushi]

Food trucks!! Now we're talkin!

[MadMax]

List of suggestions

Get rid of the pirate, Pirate's of the Caribbean is a bit out dated...Try a nemo and Dori costume character
Lower the prices of exhibitor booths bringing livestock. The vendors can then in turn lower prices driving hype and customers to the event.
Most all hype for the show comes from LIVESTOCK vendors posting in local forums the items they are bringing to the show.
Try to get free parking
Lower the cost of entry fee IE:
Senior discounts
Military Discounts
Family Rates
We think with a ten dollar entry you could drive many more people to the show.
Food Trucks for guest

For someone who was a major pain in my arse you sure has hell THINK like me.....
You've pretty much listed three fourths of my game plan, WTH!

The biggest change is to drop vendor booths prices by an entire THIRD (from $900 plus down to $600) in exchange for the vendors marketing the event instead of the promoter.
Its a radical idea but then we need radical results.

We also intend to drop admission prices by an entire THIRD (from $15 down to $10) in exchange for the attendees cleaning up after the show (Ok, Ok, I'm just kidding about the cleanup part.....maybe)
But you ae correct that a price point of $10 may very likely attract more people.

Free Parking? Since OCFEC controlls the parking fees there is ziltch I can do about that, so guess what?
I'm going to move MAX to a building that is much CLOSER to the free parking (near the swap meet)
As I said...Radical

Senior discount and Military Discount: Been doing that since day One
Family Discounts: Ok now you're talking crazy talk (must be those garage fumes)
No really, kids under 12 have always been free, its pretty much our bench mark

Nemo and Dori costume characters: are you volunteering???
garage fumes optional ;o)

[MadMax]

Have you posted this on other forums? You might be able to get some more responses and feedback on some of the other more active and larger forums.

Speaking of which, I couldn't help but notice the lack of traffic on SDReefs. Is not the MACNA crowd being directed to this site or are they being routed elsewhere?

Do you guys WANT more traffic, or do you prefer to keep it small, quaint and simple (within the SD community)?

Ive been a member for an entire decade but only to a minimum since I live in Orange County. I am a Platinum member at Barona, however, does that count? : )

[DaveMorris]

All (or most) MACNA related information is handled through the MACNA website. www.macna2016.com SDReefs is for local stuff primarily.

[MadMax]

New avatar better suits my reputation, LOL!

[sushi]

Hah! That's great, I am going to try that with my co-workers :bounce:

[russ13]

Speaking of which, I couldn't help but notice the lack of traffic on SDReefs. Is not the MACNA crowd being directed to this site or are they being routed elsewhere?

Do you guys WANT more traffic, or do you prefer to keep it small, quaint and simple (within the SD community)?

Ive been a member for an entire decade but only to a minimum since I live in Orange County. I am a Platinum member at Barona, however, does that count? : )

Why do you go all the way to Barona?? Seems kinda far from Orange County


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Their give-away incentives are unmatched by any other casino. I get a free Norwegian cruise every year for starters, VIP parking, match play coupons that are in the $100 range, not $5-$25 like all the rest. Free meal comps all the time.....speaking of which, their buffet has free all-you-can-eat crab legs that will knock-your-socks-off!

[cHRoNzZe]

I haven't had the chance to attend a show yet so I can't really speak on it...I think the price at 15$ is fair considering all the crap they have to do... I really do think that local vendors WILL drive traffic up to the show.... I saw what happen to a local vendor getting ban(and the emails) and that kinda made me not what to go.... Now to ban a vendor who doesn't want to attend or CANT attend is wrong...like you said put yourself in his shoes... He has to close up his shop on a weekend (your words""Bread and butter") and travel couple hours with a s$$t load of livestock to another location in hopes to sell everything and make a few bucks..how about if he doesn't sell enough to cover the cost..will you be buying the rest of his livestock to make up the cost?? I'm sure your not ...maybe his funds was just enough for his bills and couldn't take the chance on not putting food on the table for a day!! Just my personal opioin cause it's always 2 sides on a story

I went to your website and its not too user friendly I couldn't see any recent pics of last years shows, Try to freshen up your website with more info like what where to park,recent pictures,and what vendors have to offer.maybe even what foods are around. Even a few picture so corals from vendors

Not sure if this is already there but if I go I'll like to see some of these things....
Local stand builders? Or maybe references on where to get custom stands for your area
Coupons for local shops or online stores that can only be given at max (like free shipping on any purchase from a online vendor or 40% off corals from online vendors..etc none of that 10% off BS lol
Equipment that has been discontinued at a fraction of cost.maybe even use equipment in good shape.. A lot of us are budget reefers and don't have 500$ for a good light or a 400$ skimmer......
food .. Food ...food ....food.or a snack bar I get in a bad mood when I'm walking for 5/6 hours with no food lol

maybe a booth with books or brochures on algae control,dipping corals,how to pick right stock for your tank,how to set up a basic tank, disease,what to look for in buying a fish etc. most of us know but some people (wife's,kids) may not know and this might give them a little kick to start there own tank,all thanks to your show! I'm sure people will return for reasons like that ....

Again I haven't been to a max show yet so not sure if some of these things are there already,but if I drive for 2/3 hours just to see a bunch of corals over price, equipment that that you can't get lol (comes out next year BS) or have to drive around to find a spot to eat ...I for sure not going to attend shows after that .... Good luck with the show

Regardless i hope to make it out there next year.....

[nanoreef1]

I haven't had the chance to attend a show yet so I can't really speak on it...I think the price at 15$ is fair considering all the crap they have to do... I really do think that local vendors WILL drive traffic up to the show.... I saw what happen to a local vendor getting ban(and the emails) and that kinda made me not what to go.... Now to ban a vendor who doesn't want to attend or CANT attend is wrong...like you said put yourself in his shoes... He has to close up his shop on a weekend (your words""Bread and butter") and travel couple hours with a s$$t load of livestock to another location in hopes to sell everything and make a few bucks..how about if he doesn't sell enough to cover the cost..will you be buying the rest of his livestock to make up the cost?? I'm sure your not ...maybe his funds was just enough for his bills and couldn't take the chance on not putting food on the table for a day!! Just my personal opioin cause it's always 2 sides on a story

I went to your website and its not too user friendly I couldn't see any recent pics of last years shows, Try to freshen up your website with more info like what where to park,recent pictures,and what vendors have to offer.maybe even what foods are around. Even a few picture so corals from vendors

Not sure if this is already there but if I go I'll like to see some of these things....
Local stand builders? Or maybe references on where to get custom stands for your area
Coupons for local shops or online stores that can only be given at max (like free shipping on any purchase from a online vendor or 40% off corals from online vendors..etc none of that 10% off BS lol
Equipment that has been discontinued at a fraction of cost.maybe even use equipment in good shape.. A lot of us are budget reefers and don't have 500$ for a good light or a 400$ skimmer......
food .. Food ...food ....food.or a snack bar I get in a bad mood when I'm walking for 5/6 hours with no food lol

maybe a booth with books or brochures on algae control,dipping corals,how to pick right stock for your tank,how to set up a basic tank, disease,what to look for in buying a fish etc. most of us know but some people (wife's,kids) may not know and this might give them a little kick to start there own tank,all thanks to your show! I'm sure people will return for reasons like that ....

Again I haven't been to a max show yet so not sure if some of these things are there already,but if I drive for 2/3 hours just to see a bunch of corals over price, equipment that that you can't get lol (comes out next year BS) or have to drive around to find a spot to eat ...I for sure not going to attend shows after that .... Good luck with the show

Regardless i hope to make it out there next year.....
Well said bro.

Sent from my SM-N920T using Tapatalk

[MadMax]

Hi Guys,
Lots of good information, especially the last guy who hadn't been to a MAX before, I applaud your effort to help. Ironically those are indeed good ideas and I will address them in a bit.

But first, let me address the BAN issue and put this to rest:

EVERY business has their black list of people they choose to not do business with.....EVERYONE.
The only difference is they do not talk about it, nor should they. And it most certainly does not belong on the internet.
I have never provided my "side of the story" and I am sorry, but I have zero intentions of ever doing so....
Reefer's Garage for whatever reason chose to post private information in a public forum and now he/she will have to deal with the repercussions of doing so.
Incidentally, I've never even met the gentleman, so I will not pretend to judge someone 30+ years of life on this planet with what little limited information I have/know.
My reasons for eliminating him/her from our contact list were for business reasons only, nothing personal.


That being said, I am extremely reluctant to continuing the MAX show for these very reasons.
People make assumptions from the absence of fact, and once the momentum gets going, well......
We are caught in that momentum.

I find it very difficult to ask our professional clients to travel hundreds, if not thousands, of miles across country (and God only knows how expensive that is) to exhibit to all us HERE....only to be met with (or NOT met actually) by people who's decision-making capacity are limited to the local folklore and/or hearsay story of the day! On a personal level: If you've never met me, spoke to me, or even seen me for that matter (nor would you in most cases) I am pretty darn confident that you are ill-equipped to JUDGE me!


Let us get down to brass tacks.
Tammy and I have created this show for the betterment of the hobby since day one.
Since day one, we have taken NOT ONE DIME in compensation for our efforts.
the MAX show has been a philanthropist's effort since the very beginning. (we have never made this public information before)
For TEN YEARS Tammy has endured my fascination with this hobby, and the related show that evolved from that passion.
more importantly, she has accepted an understanding that we would never prosper financially from our efforts.
Just how many wives out there would accept such conditions?



That being said, if people get the impression that MY reputation is worthy of raking over the coals, you are more than welcome in doing so (I have nothing worthy of protecting)
HOWEVER, if anyone has the impression that I am going to CONTINUE this event AND work for free, AND somehow walk around with my tail between my legs as if I'm a beat dog who has done something wrong.....sorry folks, that isn't going to happen.

IF people want an event every April, I suggest making a change of heart, VERY SOON!

For those who really don't give a darn either way, continue the bashing to your heart's content. I am strangely neutral. (Tammy on the other hand deserves the world by most counts)

[MadMax]

UPDATE:

After multiple staff meetings and discussions with OCFEC we are going to move forward with the 10th Anniversary MAX April 1-2, 2017!

MAX 2017 will be an entirely new format in an entirely different building. (Details of these changes to be announced throughout the year)


NEW LOWER COST:

As discussed earlier in this thread we are slashing all costs by a full 1/3 margin from both the admission prices and exhibit booth prices.

- Booth prices will drop from an average of $900-$1000 to only $600 during the early bird process! (Vendor's responsibilities increase this year)

- Standard Adult Admission Prices will drop from $15 down to only $10 (Senior and Military only $5) Kids 12 & Under FREE!


EARLY BIRD REGISTRATION:

We have now begun the process of accepting reservations for those wishing to get in on the ground floor prices.

MAX 2017 will be held in the Huntington Beach Building (#12). Initial deposits are only $100 (per booth) to register and balances due in October

The new floor plan can be found on the MAX website here: http://www.marineaquariumexpo.com/EXHIBITORS/floorplan/Floorplan.html


CONTACT:

e-mail at: info@MarineAquariumExpo.com or via phone at: (714) 530-1094

Registration instructions are found here: http://www.marineaquariumexpo.com/Booking/form.html

[MadMax]

Just thumbing through some of our threads as we are preparing for MACNA this weekend
and decided to provide an update (below) in response to the suggestions made therein:

BTW, Those of you who are going to MACNA this weekend be sure to stop by the MAX booth #716 and say hi. Tammy and I will both be there...me just four weeks after undergoing full knee-replacement surgery, so I'll be gimping around with a cane (sigh!)

So, here are our responses (in red) to the comments below:




List of suggestions

- Get rid of the pirate, Pirate's of the Caribbean is a bit out dated...Try a nemo and Dori costume character
- Lower the prices of exhibitor booths bringing livestock. The vendors can then in turn lower prices driving hype and customers to the event.
DONE! Booth fees slashed by an entire 1/3 (from $900 to $600)
- Most all hype for the show comes from LIVESTOCK vendors posting in local forums the items they are bringing to the show.
DONE! Severe drop in booth fees are in trade of increased promotional responsibilities of each vendor
- Try to get free parking
DONE! One of the main reasons for moving to building #12 (Huntington Building) is that it parallels the OC Market Place (and its free parking) on the North side. Some walking will be required
- Lower the cost of entry fee IE:
DONE! We have slashed the entry fee by an entire 1/3 (from $15 to $10)
- Senior discounts
DONE! Seniors admission will be only $5 (literally HALF of last year)
- Military Discounts
DONE! Military with current I.D. will be only $5 (literally HALF of last year)
- Family Rates
DONE! Even better, we admit all children 12 years of age or younger absolutely FREE
- We think with a ten dollar entry you could drive many more people to the show.
DONE! We agree 100% and have lowered our admission fees accordingly
- Food Trucks for guest
PENDING: This is a great idea however we will have to negotiate with the contracted concessions people first.

Also look for our Full-page advertisement in the MACNA 2016 Booklet. We will be signing up booth exhibitors at MACNA this weekend at booth #716.
See you all there!